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Is the forum in a bit of a lull?

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As Neil is not on the forum (or is he!?!) to defend himself (if defend is the right term) I would just like to say as a relative newbie to the pinball scene that Neil has been nothing but welcoming & supportive to me and my son...and I miss him on the forum.

Consequently I rarely look at the forum these days but am commenting on a Whatsapp group every day - there is a lot happening in the world of pinball - just maybe not here. Which is sad.

Only writing this because of a Whatsapp thread!

Got to say I love playing in Neil's tournaments (he is an incredibly generous host as my waistline will testify!), I could never afford an Xmen LE in my house but he has loaned me his, the work he has put in to get PBR back for the benefit of pinball players in the UK is amazing...and then there is the UK Open!

I don't agree with everything he says/does - 'Disco Maiden'....so wrong...& JJP's GnR is an awesome machine 😁.

Getting to old to follow my football team around Europe (there are only so many times you can take being baton charged and tear gassed by the riot police) I thought pinball would be a nice quiet hobby to take up...how wrong was I - at least in football the enemy look you in the face when they glass you. ;)
 
Fubar said:
Glad to hear your son is playing regularly again - I'm looking forward to the day one of my own kids beats me at pinball :)

Conversely I've temporarily got a Deadpool at home which is proving to be way more addictive than I thought it would be 😎
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Be careful what you wish for mate. . . they'll be stealing your ball locks on TNA before you know it.


Glad you're enjoying Deadpool
 
I can give an example (in the hope of clarification and not an attempt to upset anyone) of not knowing what I can say anymore.

Neil was banned for the use of the word 'jaffa' in a joke. As made popular by Delboy in Only fools and horses. I have used this term in jest with friends over the years (as have they with me) and would not have guessed this is included in language considered offence.

Perhaps it's a regional thing? Perhaps I'm just an ignorant so and so? Or perhaps I am just out of touch these days. Either way, I wanted to give an example of a genuine confusion on my part and this had led to many messages being typed, re-read and then just deleted as I now am unsure what can or can't be said online anymore.

I would presume that context is important with something like this but not sure it was in Neil's case.
 
Matt Vince said:
I can give an example (in the hope of clarification and not an attempt to upset anyone) of not knowing what I can say anymore.

Neil was banned for the use of the word 'jaffa' in a joke. As made popular by Delboy in Only fools and horses. I have used this term in jest with friends over the years (as have they with me) and would not have guessed this is included in language considered offence.

Perhaps it's a regional thing? Perhaps I'm just an ignorant so and so? Or perhaps I am just out of touch these days. Either way, I wanted to give an example of a genuine confusion on my part and this had led to many messages being typed, re-read and then just deleted as I now am unsure what can or can't be said online anymore.

I would presume that context is important with something like this but not sure it was in Neil's case.
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Cockney slang for infertile 🤷‍♂️

Rightly or wrongly I thought his ban was more to do with a continuous personal attack

The bigger issue here is the moderators have to be seen to be preventing potential legal problems that could be directed at them. Some language could get them into trouble, banning someone for a short period of time covers them.

Colin definitely didn't mean anything, just sit it out he will be welcome back by everyone who's worth anything except for the very small number of trolls who won't be happy until the internet world burns.

Neil I would love back, his online perosna can be combative and his humour very dry and sarcastic and will get him into to trouble, having met him in real life he is rather different. As most very successful people are he is focused and driven, sometimes it can be in a negative way. I'm guessing this inadvertently in a drive to try and put the UK on the pinball map, he has upset and offended some, however I don't think his efforts should go unrecognised or unappreciated.

We can't all get along and in real life many wouldn't for various explainable and unexplainable reasons, hopefully at some point in the future this will all be put to bed.

Pinball is fun and shouldn't be taken too seriously hopefully we can all get back to moaning that the back to the future car doesn't reach 88mph
 
Matt Vince said:
I can give an example (in the hope of clarification and not an attempt to upset anyone) of not knowing what I can say anymore.

Neil was banned for the use of the word 'jaffa' in a joke. As made popular by Delboy in Only fools and horses. I have used this term in jest with friends over the years (as have they with me) and would not have guessed this is included in language considered offence.

Perhaps it's a regional thing? Perhaps I'm just an ignorant so and so? Or perhaps I am just out of touch these days. Either way, I wanted to give an example of a genuine confusion on my part and this had led to many messages being typed, re-read and then just deleted as I now am unsure what can or can't be said online anymore.

I would presume that context is important with something like this but not sure it was in Neil's case.
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I didn't see the problem with that either, it was bizarre - it was like a handful of people were looking for something to get offended by, especially looking for something coming from Neil, and would have been better off being ignored or at most just deleted. Re. the spat with Wayne which was another yellow card, tbh I think Wayne gives as good as he gets sometimes and had it coming. I think Neil was also caught due to having more than one account, another banable offence. None of this makes sense to me.
 
Bobbdobalina said:
Surely not?!
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No, I believe it was for continuous personal attacks against one particular person, although it's highly debatable that it's was a real issue if read objectively. Which I'm definitely not getting into. To the person receiving it, it was.
 
cmrl9 said:
Cockney slang for infertile 🤷‍♂️

Rightly or wrongly I thought his ban was more to do with a continuous personal attack

The bigger issue here is the moderators have to be seen to be preventing potential legal problems that could be directed at them. Some language could get them into trouble, banning someone for a short period of time covers them.

Colin definitely didn't mean anything, just sit it out he will be welcome back by everyone who's worth anything except for the very small number of trolls who won't be happy until the internet world burns.

Neil I would love back, his online perosna can be combative and his humour very dry and sarcastic and will get him into to trouble, having met him in real life he is rather different. As most very successful people are he is focused and driven, sometimes it can be in a negative way. I'm guessing this inadvertently in a drive to try and put the UK on the pinball map, he has upset and offended some, however I don't think his efforts should go unrecognised or unappreciated.

We can't all get along and in real life many wouldn't for various explainable and unexplainable reasons, hopefully at some point in the future this will all be put to bed.

Pinball is fun and shouldn't be taken too seriously hopefully we can all get back to moaning that the back to the future car doesn't reach 88mph
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I highly doubt you’ll see Colin back on here
 
Silverpaolo said:
I think he’s giving pinfest a break this year who knows depends how this year goes … he’s a great loss to this forum
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That's a shame, I was going and then the wife decided to have a baby which is due around the date, totally inconvenient if you ask me 🤣
 
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Silverpaolo said:
I think he’s giving pinfest a break this year who knows depends how this year goes … he’s a great loss to this forum
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Yes he is, when I first joined he was incredibly helpful and welcoming, as many on here where, I wouldn't have the knowledge I have fixing machines without the great people on here.
 
"it was like a handful of people were looking for something to get offended by"

Even better than that is people getting offended on behalf of other people (who may or may not be offended), who are likely more than capable of speaking up for themselves.... if offended.

Its the thing now.... its killing video games, movies and numerous other things.

Its been mentioned before i think but look at grid girls in formula 1. They were so thrilled that others were offended on their behalf and all lost their jobs
 
On voting for bringing Neil and/or Colin back.

This is my two cents.

If (let's say) Neil is voted to return - he will know he is untouchable by any rules.

I am not Neil bashing - I actually enjoy(ed) trying to wind him up on here and I am sure it was the same in return. He is a charitable guy and when I have met him he has been okay. He gave a massive donation at Swavesey last year. Kudos to him. Trouble is behind a keyboard then Neil wants reactions etc.

If we have full forgiveness for Neil and/or Colin then is there any point in having any rules at all?

Paul is the lord and master and as it says in the rules we all agree to - the mods are judge/jury/executioner. We can all debate about this world going too woke, especially to people of my age. Running a forum like this that is visible from public does bring dangers and situations Paul could be liable for, as he previously has said.

I am sure Paul given the right amount of money would sell Pinballinfo to Neil and he can run it without any rules and be 100% responsible for it.

Anyway - yet again - another topic that has gone off the rails.
 
Matt Vince said:
I can give an example (in the hope of clarification and not an attempt to upset anyone) of not knowing what I can say anymore.

Neil was banned for the use of the word 'jaffa' in a joke. As made popular by Delboy in Only fools and horses. I have used this term in jest with friends over the years (as have they with me) and would not have guessed this is included in language considered offence.

Perhaps it's a regional thing? Perhaps I'm just an ignorant so and so? Or perhaps I am just out of touch these days. Either way, I wanted to give an example of a genuine confusion on my part and this had led to many messages being typed, re-read and then just deleted as I now am unsure what can or can't be said online anymore.

I would presume that context is important with something like this but not sure it was in Neil's case.
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He wasnt.

Just for clarity, Neil was banned for a string of offences. He had previously been suspended three times before the ban. It was just that the last one took him over the threshold of a perm Ban. Those decisions i dont take lightly, and I also take a step back and have to think completely objectively. Take the offence in isolation. At the end of the day the comment was an attack at someone. Minimum 10 points. which unfortunately because of his priors took him over that line.

I would like to think that if someone had been banned for 2 weeks, then one month, then 6 months that they would understand what was acceptable or not.

Also, there are certain phrases that are said between friends in a casual context that would be acceptible in that personal circumstances - usually uniquely between those people. Calling someone it on a public forum is something completely different. I say things to my old team that others here just wouldnt understand or get. That doesnt mean i could say it to a stranger and the meaning be the same.

This does NOT include racist comments, which i would like to think would be wholey unacceptible, even in jest. I completely get that different people of a different era view different things to be acceptible. However on some things we ALL have to move with the times.

Those that have met and know me, even in passing, i would like to think know me as someone who is fairly laid back. The same applies on here. No need to get all bitter and twisted about everything - it's an easy way to an early grave. I am probably the least "woke" person you would meet.

Silverpaolo said:
I highly doubt you’ll see Colin back on here
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Which will be a real shame. Once whatever ban is served is over them anyone is welcomed back. Time will have been served.
 
Pick Holder said:
On voting for bringing Neil and/or Colin back.

This is my two cents.

If (let's say) Neil is voted to return - he will know he is untouchable by any rules.

I am not Neil bashing - I actually enjoy(ed) trying to wind him up on here and I am sure it was the same in return. He is a charitable guy and when I have met him he has been okay. He gave a massive donation at Swavesey last year. Kudos to him. Trouble is behind a keyboard then Neil wants reactions etc.

If we have full forgiveness for Neil and/or Colin then is there any point in having any rules at all?

Paul is the lord and master and as it says in the rules we all agree to - the mods are judge/jury/executioner. We can all debate about this world going too woke, especially to people of my age. Running a forum like this that is visible from public does bring dangers and situations Paul could be liable for, as he previously has said.

I am sure Paul given the right amount of money would sell Pinballinfo to Neil and he can run it without any rules and be 100% responsible for it.

Anyway - yet again - another topic that has gone off the rails.
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Neil already kept trying to push, that eventually got him banned. Reinstating him would open a whole different can of worms.

How about we talk about it the snake will still eat the ball in the rumoured Metallica remake
 
Pick Holder said:
Paul is the lord and master and as it says in the rules we all agree to
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Just to pick up on this. I dont see myself as that - far from it.

I am merely just the custodean of this place, until such time that I am sane enough to decide it's time to get a life back.
Or until that elusive big lottery win comes in..... whichever comes first :D

THIS is why we dont see many people banned here. I prefer to give people the benefit of the doubt. BUT. Cross certain lines - if something is unfair on others - if something is plain wrong - or if someone does something that could get any of the Mods/Admins in trouble or put the forum in jeopardy, thats a different kettle of fish altogether.

This is supposed to be a safe place for ALL. I prefer to keep it that way.
 
Paul said:
He wasnt.

Just for clarity, Neil was banned for a string of offences. He had previously been suspended three times before the ban. It was just that the last one took him over the threshold of a perm Ban. Those decisions i dont take lightly, and I also take a step back and have to think completely objectively. Take the offence in isolation. At the end of the day the comment was an attack at someone. Minimum 10 points. which unfortunately because of his priors took him over that line.

I would like to think that if someone had been banned for 2 weeks, then one month, then 6 months that they would understand what was acceptable or not.

Also, there are certain phrases that are said between friends in a casual context that would be acceptible in that personal circumstances - usually uniquely between those people. Calling someone it on a public forum is something completely different. I say things to my old team that others here just wouldnt understand or get. That doesnt mean i could say it to a stranger and the meaning be the same.

This does NOT include racist comments, which i would like to think would be wholey unacceptible, even in jest. I completely get that different people of a different era view different things to be acceptible. However on some things we ALL have to move with the times.

Those that have met and know me, even in passing, i would like to think know me as someone who is fairly laid back. The same applies on here. No need to get all bitter and twisted about everything - it's an easy way to an early grave. I am probably the least "woke" person you would meet.


Which will be a real shame. Once whatever ban is served is over them anyone is welcomed back. Time will have been served.
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Certainly a real shame , I can’t speak for col but from my interactions with him it’s something he’s not keen on revisiting even when his ban is up
 
paulg100 said:
"it was like a handful of people were looking for something to get offended by"
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Any examples? I only know of the racial slurs and to me that's justified.
I don't recall any other instances of people looking for or being offended by things?
I really think people put 2+2 together and make 5
 
People also have short term memory, or perhaps haven't been here long enough to know that many people have been perm banned for their own daft actions within the community

In pretty much every case there would have been opportunities to apologise and change course, but for whatever reason these people dug their heels in and essentially ostracised themselves

(Not talking about Col here. Col is of course only temp banned and has to my knowledge put out a thorough apology for his mistakes)
 
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