Pinball info
Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Underpricing pins is harming the hobby
- Thread starter VeeMonroe
- Start date
- Status
Not really - to be clear, someone already has expressed a strong interest in it, so they will have first dibs IF I decide to move it on!You've just created a lot of PM's for yourself
Juggler Spencer
Registered
Juggler Spencer
Registered
A lot of people have been talking about Pinball Club.
What's the first true of Pinball Club?
What's the first true of Pinball Club?
If it was that simple…
Apologies for the long post…
There’s a huge social factor. I’ve been following the For Sale/Wanted threads and the number that have turned into radioactive trash fires, recently…
If you can get a ‘For Sale’ thread with pictures and a price, which doesn’t end up warranting an anti-radiation suit and popcorn (or locked by the mods), you’re doing really well.We had the guy who was selling the TSPP (if I remember correctly) with the skill posts and alleged low plays. You’d think people would leave the thread alone if they didn’t like the price and didn’t want to buy it, but it ended up in a big discussion about the value of skill posts. My LoTR, unusually for a UK LoTR, doesn’t have skill posts, so I unknowingly joined in the chat. Suddenly, @Colywobbles (I think, if I remember correctly, I’d need to check to get the details right) turns up saying the guy has been on the phone really upset about the pile-on and criticisms, not wanting to sell the TSPP on the forums, and so on. It was shortly after the mods had implemented the ‘bad posters negative scores’ feature and someone pointed out that it was always the same people posting on the threads that turn into trash fires. I’ve got to say - I felt really guilty. I felt personally responsible for accidentally joining a pile on that had evidently really upset someone and, yep, for always being around when there was a thread that turned into a toxic bin fire.
Later, there was a newbie poster who posted wanting a GZ. Someone tagged me as someone who had a GZ. I said mine wasn’t for sale, but that subscribed me to the thread. I noticed @Silverpaolo made a joke and, next minute, my phone went mad pinging with notifications because the original guy just totally flipped the table. He was posting one reply after another, not even waiting for a response, just bathing everyone on the forum in flames - even people who weren’t anything to do with the thread. I tried defending @Silverpaolo, and the poster went after me, and @Silverpaolo and I were just PMing back-and-forth wondering what the actual… was going on with this person. I think he got banned in the end. He was still flaming @Neil McRae (completely at random because he wasn’t anything to do with it) after the thread got locked. The only thing I can think is that the guy was terribly frustrated that a GZ offer was not forthcoming, and just blamed everyone else for that - and I felt a little bit sorry for him, because I was feeling a bit frustrated about my Wanted threads, even though it was a total overreaction on his part.
The most recent one was the 10k TAF with no pictures forthcoming. I mean, again, you could ignore and walk on, that would be the logical thing, but everyone’s obviously bothered about pricing so - again - epic bin fire straight out of the gate.
I‘ve probably forgotten others (well, like Rossco, but that’s not the same thing).
I mean, that’s how communities are, and it’s good that people are policing condition, description and pictures, but there’s a lot of heat and sensitivity around price right now. It’s not just “Oh, it’s not complex, just turn up with a price and a picture and see if anyone bites, no skin off my nose”.
Some of these posts make War and Peace look like a concise read.Four pages of 'discussion', 'argument', 'mild insults' and 'polarised views' later... I reckon this is arguably the best thread in a while.
I'm totally ****ing lost at this point. What's this thread about?
The struggles of humanity
Queuing for Conrad's TNA
Oh, oh, pick me, pick me, pick me!
Oi, hands off . . . he's my friend.
Queuing for Conrad's TNA
Sign me up!
It didn't have a coherent point in post #1, and went downhill from there
It's a complete non-issue. The only issue is there aren't enough Pins to go around.
Not getting what you want is part of life.
Not getting what you want is part of life.
Lecari
Site Supporter
I mean, @David_Vi and I have gone from having a 4 pin collection to 11 in 6 months, so I'm not sure there is an issue with buying and selling pins at the moment...!
We bought them through a mix of forum posts and from having friends in the community. Everyone I've met has been friendly, welcoming, inclusive and willing to help out newbies. David and I, in turn, have gotten involved and helped others where possible and now we've started to host pinball events, too.
I wouldn't have gotten my Diner grail pin if not for the pinball community here on the forum, for example - I just had to be a little patient. We've only been to collect one pin in person, just because we were impatient and didn't want to wait for Martin. Only one we went to see in person and got to play first (and mostly because we were going to be in the area), but also it was just great to meet up and have a chat with a fellow pinballer!
We bought them through a mix of forum posts and from having friends in the community. Everyone I've met has been friendly, welcoming, inclusive and willing to help out newbies. David and I, in turn, have gotten involved and helped others where possible and now we've started to host pinball events, too.
I wouldn't have gotten my Diner grail pin if not for the pinball community here on the forum, for example - I just had to be a little patient. We've only been to collect one pin in person, just because we were impatient and didn't want to wait for Martin. Only one we went to see in person and got to play first (and mostly because we were going to be in the area), but also it was just great to meet up and have a chat with a fellow pinballer!
I don't know why but I'm finding the random Neil bit hilarious
It's about how pins are overvalued and ruining the hobby
The Sales/Wanted thread seems a bit of a fraught place right now, in an otherwise friendly forum, and I can't believe it's taken me three months to source a fourth pin. Wow, I can't begin to imagine that being my first pin. Is it usually that difficult to buy a physical object at the going rate? Is it more difficult than usual at the moment?
Maybe the problem is that the estimated prices of pins I saw quoted seem to be £500 to £5k (!! I didn't buy that!) below the prices I found in practice, so people aren't selling (?).
Maybe if everyone added £500 to sale prices on the forums, things would be less crazy - at least in the short term (?).
Maybe I should suggest that (ducks into foxhole in hazmat suit).
Or maybe I'm just missing the secret Masonic handshake that gives me access to Pinball Club...
Answers: Yes, it is that difficult in some circumstances and that seems to be the way things are traditionally done. Some people who've contributed to the thread are comfortable with this. Yes, it is harder than usual right now. No, there is no Masonic handshake. There is a problem with people selling via PM using the valuations thread.
Last edited:
You're repeating yourself even though you've had answers.
You're complaining it took you three months to get a fourth pin? You were specific about what you wanted, you weren't going to buy anything that popped up.
It took me nearly a year to find my Road Show, my first pin. Then I bought Black Rose the same week on impulse when it appeared on the forum, when actually my only experience of it was pinball fx3 and I hated it (then loved it irl!).
I had wanted threads here and FB and was determined for RS to be my first pin. Three months is nothing for a fourth pin too
There's no secret pinball club, people have pointed this out repeatedly, and if you really think there is ,why don't you join it?
If you couldn't wait three months you could have imported or bought any pin from eBay, FB or whatever popped up but you didn't want to do that because it wasn't the right pin?
You can't have it both ways.
Jib
Site Supporter
3 months really isn't very long, plenty of people have been waiting much longer for NIB machines theyve put deposits down on. Lots of physical things have long wait times right now. It took 9 months to get our shed that we paid in full for at time of order. New cars have a wait list, etc. etc.
This is the key point. If you want a specific machine / machines when there is a very limited supply out there you just have to learn to be patient. If no owners want to sell, you aren’t going to get one. I’ve waited much, much longer than three months to find some machines - it’s just how it is. It doesn't have anything to do with pricing, perceived or otherwise.
To add to the secret pin club thing, did you read what @Jmac said about the glass and BR?
Another example. @Baza posted asking where he could get some wide body glass. I've never met him before but I'd just upgraded to Invisible glass so had a spare sheet from Road Show.
I offended him it for free, he came next day and spent a few hours here chatting, playing Pinball and has since messaged me showing his game and the progress on it. I'd never met him before that day.
I've met people at events for first time and often it comes up about trading or swapping games at some point. It's convenience.
It's not a club, you meet people through the hobby and sometimes you stay in touch or see them at events.
Another example. @Baza posted asking where he could get some wide body glass. I've never met him before but I'd just upgraded to Invisible glass so had a spare sheet from Road Show.
I offended him it for free, he came next day and spent a few hours here chatting, playing Pinball and has since messaged me showing his game and the progress on it. I'd never met him before that day.
I've met people at events for first time and often it comes up about trading or swapping games at some point. It's convenience.
It's not a club, you meet people through the hobby and sometimes you stay in touch or see them at events.
Doggard
Site Supporter
When I joined here last year, I made it known I was looking for my first pin ( although I changed my mind, and bought another v pin )
But as a newbie, I was given some great advice from members, also some members messaged me, when a pin came up for sale, giving me the heads up that the machine for sale was a good buy, from a trusted seller. Which I thought was kind, considering no one knew me from Adam.
As I don’t own any pins myself, I’ve also had members offer me to go to their house and play pins, also a nice gesture
I’ve been to a couple of tournaments now, and met fellow forum members, and everyone in the community is really friendly and helpful
I’ve yet to see any funny handshakes, or people talking in code !
But as a newbie, I was given some great advice from members, also some members messaged me, when a pin came up for sale, giving me the heads up that the machine for sale was a good buy, from a trusted seller. Which I thought was kind, considering no one knew me from Adam.
As I don’t own any pins myself, I’ve also had members offer me to go to their house and play pins, also a nice gesture
I’ve been to a couple of tournaments now, and met fellow forum members, and everyone in the community is really friendly and helpful
I’ve yet to see any funny handshakes, or people talking in code !
I am sorry but the premise of this original thread is nonsense.
The fundamental issue here, as per @Sgt GrizZ , is that we are in what was known on the old stock exchange floor as a "fast market". This fast market has been caused by idiotic covid lockdowns and associated money printing.
Prices are all over the place. Conventions designed to protect participants like not dealing on a backwardation are suspended. Nervous folk sit paralyzed watching it all. Bold folk actually trade, but at volatile prices.
I think we are also approaching "Veblen Good" territory - and this is not a good thing. Games rooms, garden rooms, outside hot tubs, home gyms .... are all becoming status symbols following lockdowns.
I did not even know what a Veblen Good is until yesterday but as my mate turned a 28k Patek Philippe watch into a 100k watch in about three years I read up on it.
What Is a Veblen Good?
The fundamental issue here, as per @Sgt GrizZ , is that we are in what was known on the old stock exchange floor as a "fast market". This fast market has been caused by idiotic covid lockdowns and associated money printing.
Prices are all over the place. Conventions designed to protect participants like not dealing on a backwardation are suspended. Nervous folk sit paralyzed watching it all. Bold folk actually trade, but at volatile prices.
I think we are also approaching "Veblen Good" territory - and this is not a good thing. Games rooms, garden rooms, outside hot tubs, home gyms .... are all becoming status symbols following lockdowns.
I did not even know what a Veblen Good is until yesterday but as my mate turned a 28k Patek Philippe watch into a 100k watch in about three years I read up on it.
What Is a Veblen Good?
- A Veblen good is a good for which demand increases as the price increases.
- Veblen goods are typically high-quality goods that are made well, are exclusive, and are a status symbol.
- Veblen goods are generally sought after by affluent consumers who place a premium on the utility of the good.
Folks. I've just clarified above. In the nicest possible way, you're now having an argument with someone who isn't in the room
Just to be clear, I had a long list of 10+ pins with people suggesting other alternatives too - all of which I researched on Pinside/Youtube. I appreciated, and still appreciate, that the likelihood of me getting a Laser Cue (or a US Black Hole) - for example - was near zero. I don't think it was unrealistic, however, that I was expecting someone to sell something off a quite long list, especially when some of those things had big production runs.
It's not like ordering a specific shed. It's more like going "Hey, does anyone have a nice shed of dimensions X, Y and Z where I could keep three spades and a lawnmower" and then being offered a really small shed, a really huge shed, and told you're being unrealistic about the condition of the shed. You'd start idly wondering what's going on with the second-hand shed market...
This is exactly how I met Andy.
I'd advertised a gimp suit, some tassels and an Ann Summers compendium of fun on ebay and Andy won the auction.
When he popped over to collect the items he noticed Popeye and said, "Wow, the best machine ever made. I'm into pinball too."
We became friends instantly and he sold me his Lord of the Rings LE for £485.
It's very odd for a member of a hobby to be campaigning for higher prices, with the aim of getting less experienced members into it.
- Status