The OFFICIAL LICENSED 'moans about pricing' thread

[MajesticPinball]

I am fed-up that my comments get judged, dissected, taken out of context, trivialised or manipulated. It looks like we also have an emotional/feeling police! If I have to always be concerned that someone will judge me, then it's definitely not the right place for me. If there is an option to "Ignore" a member, please do so with me.

There are many things I don't like when I read a post, but I try to be tolerant to understand someone's perspective, instead of criticise who they are as a person. I never once disrespected or belittle others for their perspective.

This forum won't last long, if people are concerned to express themselves.

I didn't actually mention you at any point though did I? - it was more a generalisation of how these threads have all been going recently, with general entitlement and money talk, but if you're putting on the boot...

You are correct however, people are more than welcome to express themselves however they feel on this forum and I absolutely encourage that, it would be one boring place if we all agreed all the time... but I'm also allowed to express myself, and if I'm getting tired of grown adults having tantrums over missing out on luxury, expensive toys that (in the grand scheme of things) none of us actually need, I will say so.

 

[JMP]

and if I'm getting tired of grown adults having tantrums over missing out on luxury, expensive toys that (in the grand scheme of things) none of us actually need, I will say so.

You and a lot of others James. We're at a time when saying 'tough' 'deal with it' or 'suck it up'' is frowned upon.... soon, there'll be a pinball 'me too' movement on people not getting what they want as soon as they want it. Some of the threads/posts in here these days are a joke and feels like facebook disease, shame really.

 

[Arv]

Entitled Amazonians John.

 

[VeeMonroe]

Since unfortunately, I seemed to have caused the bubble to burst about this topic, I would like to explain myself as it really upset some people, including me.

I am French Canadian. Even after 23 years in the UK, I still don't understand people sometimes, especially the banter and black British humour. It's also not uncommon that people don't understand me, because I am poor at small talk, but love digging deep into comments or situations. I never intend to disrespect, belittle or hurt others, but I am opinionated and go too far sometimes. I like long posts or replies

While it's been already mentioned, I can be paranoid, envious and jealous at times. I am also sensitive to unfairness and greed. That is my burden to carry and change that for the better. I don't mind sharing my deficiencies, which is what I did in my controversial reply. It might be a risky thing to do in a public forum, but in that I get emotional freedom.

I recognised that some members go out of their way to help others, even at their own emotional and financial costs. The level of knowledge in this forum is impressive, there is an answer for almost everything. The interest about the hobby greatly varies, from the curious to the die hard passionate. This is a good thing, but it must be met by tolerance and respect. Those are some of the great assets of this forum.

About my reply ...

I apologies to anyone who got annoyed or angry by my reply. I will do better next time. I ran a forum years ago. It's difficult and annoying to direct users to an appropriate thread. Many people like to carry on a conversation in its context, because it's natural to do that.

It might surprise some, but I had NO IDEA that I was doing something wrong. This negative reaction took me completely off my feet. I usually don't read the comments in "For Sale" unless they concern me. I became quite upset by the intensity of the discussion and the disrespectul comments I received.

I am STILL A NOOBIE who is trying to navigate the hobby. When I did my blunder, I would have appreciated a gracious reply, instead of being shot and chastised. Only one member took the time to PM me for clarifications. I was glad to oblige, but by then the discussion was beyond mending.

Please be gracious to noobies, you were one at some point.

Cheers

There is no need to apologise - or list all your perceived flaws This ain’t the inquisition.

I like the idea that I could get a TOTAN and now a Guns and Roses Data East at a very good price in Spain. I have not finished the negotiation with the seller, but I am hopeful that he will offer me a good deal.

Someone mentioned that it might not be a good idea, why? I will pick them up as part of a holiday.

What would be the price point to purchase those machines abroad and still have a bargain?

Okay. I’ve also considered importing pins (and others on the forum import pins), but I think - in your case - it’s probably unnecessary.

Unless you’re lucky enough to find your perfect pin in your ideal holiday destination, you’re organising your holiday around a pin acquisition. This means, if you turn up and you’re being offered a pile of firewood with expensive-to-fix faults, it’s going to feel harder to walk away once you’ve flown/ferried/driven all that distance. Also, you need to mess about with VAT and import tax, etc.

From reading your posts, you are not terribly picky about pins. You’re interested in everything from Grand Lizard to TOTAN. You also seem to have a budget of £4,000 at least, excluding imports. Thus, it should be easy for you to source a pin in the UK if you know where to look.

Places to look (apart from these forums) include:

1. Pinball Machines for Sale in the UK Facebook Group
2. Tobin, a dealer well known on the forum whose contact details I (and apparently several others) have provided you with
3. If you want a very specific pin, James Bird @ CoinOpKing (Google for the website) has literally hundreds of pins. They tend to be priced relatively high because he runs an import/export business, but you will be able to find pins that may be rare in the collector community (e.g. Laser Cue)
4. I and others have bought pins from Williams Amusements but, again, he costs more and you need to check the condition very carefully

You can also post a Wanted ad on the forum, if you haven’t done so already. In fact, I’d recommend that as a first-choice option. If you post an advert, and are looking for a specific pin, people will often be kind enough to PM you if they see one on FB Marketplace (or know of someone with one). Given how many pins you seem to be open to, you could post a general Wanted advert, e.g. Looking for a Bally-Williams era pin with a budget of £4K. I have been offered multiple pins based on a Wanted ad, including titles I hadn’t previously considered.

If your budget stretches to new-in-box, the trusted retailer on the forum is Phil @ Pinball Heaven. Right now, it looks like he has a Cactus Canyon remake by Chicago Gaming Company available (https://www.pinball.co.uk/pinball-machines-for-sale/cactus-canyon-by-chicago-gaming-company/), which is a remake of a much-loved B/W-era pin in the same vague family of pins as Medieval Madness, Monster Bash and Attack from Mars. I’m personally not a massive fan of CC, but it is a colourful pin with lots of fun toys and CGC has a good reputation.

It’s worth mentioning that buying pinball machines is more like buying a house than buying an iPhone. There are only a few manufacturers, the biggest of whom - Stern - is currently struggling to ramp up production to meet order volumes. The vast majority of pinball machines are vintage, come in a variety of conditions, and repair/maintenance is usually a core part of ownership.

 

[Bobbdobalina]

My next door neighbour has it but is completely unaware of the significance

It was there from the previous occupant and I'm saying nothing

Had it outside mine for years, expected so much but was sorely disappointed.
Hacked it down 2 years ago…

 

[VeeMonroe]

I didn't actually mention you at any point though did I? - it was more a generalisation of how these threads have all been going recently, with general entitlement and money talk, but if you're putting on the boot...

You are correct however, people are more than welcome to express themselves however they feel on this forum and I absolutely encourage that, it would be one boring place if we all agreed all the time... but I'm also allowed to express myself, and if I'm getting tired of grown adults having tantrums over missing out on luxury, expensive toys that (in the grand scheme of things) none of us actually need, I will say so.

I think S00n’s excellent newbie’s guide just needs ‘stickying’ and expanding a bit to cover ways to purchase a pin outside the forums

A 'complete' newbies guide - perspective from someone who came in knowing nothing about pinball

Hi all, So I've been in this hobby about a year and within that time I've had: Star Trek Premium Black Knight Swords of Rage Premium Stranger Things Pro Hook Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Pro Alien SV (Pinball Brothers) Bram Stokers Dracula The Shadow Creature From the Black Lagoon Jurassic...

www.pinballinfo.com

Otherwise, people turn up here and are told ’buy a pin from the forums and not HLD’ and, then, if they find that hard, they’re then told ‘snooze and you lose’ or ‘you need to make friends with people’ (which is fair enough, but it takes years to become a trusted member of a community)

They’re not entitled, they’re just confused

If you think about it, houses and cars, the most expensive items most people are likely to purchase, have whole websites devoted to identifying things to buy and sell. So, you can see where the confusion is coming from.

 

[Marvello]

 

[Asiapinball]

My next door neighbour has it but is completely unaware of the significance

It was there from the previous occupant and I'm saying nothing

When we moved in here we had it around the back and I don't know if that means anything different to having it in the front. Wife didn't like it so it got removed within a couple of months of moving in.

 

[Doggard]

Just had to Google the significance of pampas in front garden !

 

[Jay Walker]

Does that still apply, then?

 

[Bobbdobalina]

When we moved in here we had it around the back and I don't know if that means anything different to having it in the front. Wife didn't like it so it got removed within a couple of months of moving in.

This thread is deteriorating fast

 

[Doggard]

My parents have had it in the front garden for years !

I’m now sitting here discombobulated, and questioning my very existence!

 

[Marvello]

My parents have had it in the front garden for years !

I’m now sitting here discombobulated, and questioning my very existence!

Have you got a lot of "Uncles" and "Aunties"?

 

[Jackpot]

My parents have had it in the front garden for years !

I’m now sitting here discombobulated, and questioning my very existence!

Is this the right time to admit every time I read your "Doggard" handle, I think "Dogger" by association instead... ?

 

[Asiapinball]

I like the idea that I could get a TOTAN and now a Guns and Roses Data East at a very good price in Spain. I have not finished the negotiation with the seller, but I am hopeful that he will offer me a good deal.

Someone mentioned that it might not be a good idea, why? I will pick them up as part of a holiday.

What would be the price point to purchase those machines abroad and still have a bargain?

You really have 2 questions. What's a good price for the machines landed and is it best to ship or road trip and collect. Below gives my view on second q. I'll let others answer first.

Financially you will probably need to factor in at least £1,000 maybe £1,200 or more for a 2,500 mile / 40 hour road trip to pay for fuel road tolls return ferry extra car insurance and breakdown cover plus overnight accommodation.

Plus there will be 20pct vat to pay unless you successfully smuggle it in and if you are trying to do that you need to decide how you would deal with it emotionally if customs confiscated the machines and whether you are up to blagging it with customs if they do stop you.

So a euro 5k machine would either cost you at least £5,500 if you successfully smuggled, or at least £6,300 if you declared and paid the vat and probably more than that if you got caught smuggling.

If you paid euro 5k for the machine plus 500 quid for shipping plus 1k vat you would have it delivered for £6k.

So financially there isn't much difference between having it shipped and collecting but you would effectively get free holiday travel to and from Spain (or at a cost of £300 if you declare and pay the vat) but against that there is 40 hours driving realistically over 4 days of your time unless you see it as a road trip holiday and actually want to stop and visit things along the way.

Otherwise get it shipped and spend the £300 you save over road trip with vat with easyjet as is far more convenient.

Paul

 

[Doggard]

Have you got a lot of "Uncles" and "Aunties"?

Funnily enough, yes !

 

[paul h]

Pampas grass used to be dirt cheap in the '80s. Nowadays, newbies can't get into the hobby because prices are so high that nobody wants to sell unless you've got a van. I reckon garden centres ought to charge more so that newbies can get in on the act.

 

[Doggard]

Is this the right time to admit every time I read your "Doggard" handle, I think "Dogger" by association instead... ?

Doggard is an extension of the nick name I’ve had for 33 years “ dog”

It has a story as to why I have it, but it’s not nothing to do with sexual activities

 

[VeeMonroe]

This thread is no longer OFFICIAL or LICENSED. You can post your pricing flames to:

For Sale - Medieval Madness LE

Thinking of selling my MM remake LE. Upgraded to led lighting Led mod on the trolls Low reflection glass Shaker motor All the original parts come with the pin Its in excellent condition Whats it worth?

www.pinballinfo.com

There are some things that money can buy. But, Medieval Madness LE, it is PRICELESS….

 

[Gonzo]

Can this be re-titled as the OFFICIAL Pampas Grass thread?

 

[Arv]

You really have 2 questions. What's a good price for the machines landed and is it best to ship or road trip and collect. Below gives my view on second q. I'll let others answer first.

Financially you will probably need to factor in at least £1,000 maybe £1,200 or more for a 2,500 mile / 40 hour road trip to pay for fuel road tolls return ferry extra car insurance and breakdown cover plus overnight accommodation.

Plus there will be 20pct vat to pay unless you successfully smuggle it in and if you are trying to do that you need to decide how you would deal with it emotionally if customs confiscated the machines and whether you are up to blagging it with customs if they do stop you.

So a euro 5k machine would either cost you at least £5,500 if you successfully smuggled, or at least £6,300 if you declared and paid the vat and probably more than that if you got caught smuggling.

If you paid euro 5k for the machine plus 500 quid for shipping plus 1k vat you would have it delivered for £6k.

So financially there isn't much difference between having it shipped and collecting but you would effectively get free holiday travel to and from Spain (or at a cost of £300 if you declare and pay the vat) but against that there is 40 hours driving realistically over 4 days of your time unless you see it as a road trip holiday and actually want to stop and visit things along the way.

Otherwise get it shipped and spend the £300 you save over road trip with vat with easyjet as is far more convenient.

Paul

It's a fair old trek. I remember planning to go to Germany if I won the Flash Gordon that was on eBay.de at the time. I was out bid (thank god) and when I looked at what I was planning to for the sake of this hobby i had serious words with myself.

I eventually got the Flash Gordon off eBay UK for the sum of around £230 or something.

 

[PAX]

Can't believe no one has got upset since 10:38 this morning.
Everyone must've gone to garden centres looking for pampas grass...

 

[Jagspete]

Can't believe no one has got upset since 10:38 this morning.
Everyone must've gone to garden centres looking for pampas grass...

All sold out near us!

 

[Aladeran]

I didn't actually mention you at any point though did I? - it was more a generalisation of how these threads have all been going recently, with general entitlement and money talk, but if you're putting on the boot...

You are correct however, people are more than welcome to express themselves however they feel on this forum and I absolutely encourage that, it would be one boring place if we all agreed all the time... but I'm also allowed to express myself, and if I'm getting tired of grown adults having tantrums over missing out on luxury, expensive toys that (in the grand scheme of things) none of us actually need, I will say so.

I think that it's not an uncommon reaction to have tantrums about object of luxuries. I've been collecting stamps and rare books for years. When I attend an auction, it can sometimes be dominated by elderly men having tantrums. It's fun to watch, but also sad at times.

Passionate collectors can be prone to that character flaw, especially after investing a good part of their life in their hobby. They can also suffer of envy, jealousy, etc. when they loose a bid for a once in a lifetime stamp.

I would consider my stamp collection to be similar to those who own 25+ pinballs. I know how frustrating and discouraging it can be for those who have just joined the hobby. I try to accommodate new collectors, by giving them a few good quality stamps and advice.

For anyone willing, I would be happy to trade a rare and expensive stamp for a TAF

 

[Paul]

Nothings "Officially Licenced" until i say it is. Admin Rules

 

[Aladeran]

There is no need to apologise - or list all your perceived flaws This ain’t the inquisition.


Okay. I’ve also considered importing pins (and others on the forum import pins), but I think - in your case - it’s probably unnecessary.

Unless you’re lucky enough to find your perfect pin in your ideal holiday destination, you’re organising your holiday around a pin acquisition. This means, if you turn up and you’re being offered a pile of firewood with expensive-to-fix faults, it’s going to feel harder to walk away once you’ve flown/ferried/driven all that distance. Also, you need to mess about with VAT and import tax, etc.

From reading your posts, you are not terribly picky about pins. You’re interested in everything from Grand Lizard to TOTAN. You also seem to have a budget of £4,000 at least, excluding imports. Thus, it should be easy for you to source a pin in the UK if you know where to look.

Places to look (apart from these forums) include:

1. Pinball Machines for Sale in the UK Facebook Group
2. Tobin, a dealer well known on the forum whose contact details I (and apparently several others) have provided you with
3. If you want a very specific pin, James Bird @ CoinOpKing (Google for the website) has literally hundreds of pins. They tend to be priced relatively high because he runs an import/export business, but you will be able to find pins that may be rare in the collector community (e.g. Laser Cue)
4. I and others have bought pins from Williams Amusements but, again, he costs more and you need to check the condition very carefully

You can also post a Wanted ad on the forum, if you haven’t done so already. In fact, I’d recommend that as a first-choice option. If you post an advert, and are looking for a specific pin, people will often be kind enough to PM you if they see one on FB Marketplace (or know of someone with one). Given how many pins you seem to be open to, you could post a general Wanted advert, e.g. Looking for a Bally-Williams era pin with a budget of £4K. I have been offered multiple pins based on a Wanted ad, including titles I hadn’t previously considered.

If your budget stretches to new-in-box, the trusted retailer on the forum is Phil @ Pinball Heaven. Right now, it looks like he has a Cactus Canyon remake by Chicago Gaming Company available (https://www.pinball.co.uk/pinball-machines-for-sale/cactus-canyon-by-chicago-gaming-company/), which is a remake of a much-loved B/W-era pin in the same vague family of pins as Medieval Madness, Monster Bash and Attack from Mars. I’m personally not a massive fan of CC, but it is a colourful pin with lots of fun toys and CGC has a good reputation.

It’s worth mentioning that buying pinball machines is more like buying a house than buying an iPhone. There are only a few manufacturers, the biggest of whom - Stern - is currently struggling to ramp up production to meet order volumes. The vast majority of pinball machines are vintage, come in a variety of conditions, and repair/maintenance is usually a core part of ownership.

This is really good advice and much appreciated.

 

[VeeMonroe]

I think that it's not an uncommon reaction to have tantrums about object of luxuries. I've been collecting stamps and rare books for years. When I attend an auction, it can sometimes be dominated by elderly men having tantrums. It's fun to watch, but also sad at times.

Passionate collectors can be prone to that character flaw, especially after investing a good part of their life in their hobby. They can also suffer of envy, jealousy, etc. when they loose a bid for a once in a lifetime stamp.

I’ve run several very large board game auctions and the work of running the auction (rather than the shipping) is 10% auction and 90% managing geek rage…

 

[AlanJ]

i’d like to moan about the lack of moans on pricing.

mind you £250 for that GnR topper is ridiculous.

 

[Marvello]

Most people have come to accept the high price of Pinball nowadays so there isn't much to moan about without sounding like a broken record. You either put up or you shut up.

 

[Doggard]

Most people have come to accept the high price of Pinball nowadays so there isn't much to moan about without sounding like a broken record. You either put up or you shut up.

Yeah it’s not like it’s a necessity, unlike energy/ fuel and food !