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Pinball Universe

  • Thread starter Thread starter Deleted member 2463
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Same for GPE being discussed in the molex thread;

United Kingdom Customers -
Effective 1-Jan-2021, the UK now expects foreign sellers to collect VAT in advance. If the VAT is not prepaid, the order will be shipped back to the seller at a complete loss of expensive shipping charges. It is bad enough collecting taxes for local customers but a bit overwhelming to collect taxes for orders shipped to other countries as well. Unfortunately, I do not currently have the method or time to collect these taxes for UK orders. Shipping orders to UK is now temporarily disabled. Hope to get this resolved in the future.
 
That’s really ****!


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"the UK now expects foreign sellers to collect VAT in advance"

No it doesn't, goods should be shipped without any VAT and the VAT is paid on entry to UK. The shipping handlers pay the VAT and then charge recipient VAT and handling charge. That is how it has always worked when shipping from EU to non EU country or non EU country to UK.

David
 
DAFlippers said:
"the UK now expects foreign sellers to collect VAT in advance"

No it doesn't, goods should be shipped without any VAT and the VAT is paid on entry to UK. The shipping handlers pay the VAT and then charge recipient VAT and handling charge. That is how it has always worked when shipping from EU to non EU country or non EU country to UK.

David
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Sounds absolutely ridiculous. It has always been the way David has explained it when ordering from non-EU countries. Why change it?

So if GPE charges VAT on UK orders is he expected to send a cheque to HMRC? [emoji2] How the hell are they going to check?

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The principle hasn't changed. No one can charge UK VAT unless they have a UK VAT number. Anyone saying they have to collect UK VAT that does not have a UK VAT number is talking out of their backside.

What happens if that company sends goods to Norway? They won't collect Norwegian VAT, the liability occurs at the border.

David
 
It’s clear on the link above David.

Consignments valued at £135 or less​

The seller must charge and account for VAT at the point of sale, unless the consignment is a business to business sale and the customer has given them their UK VAT registration number.

To charge and account for VAT the seller will need to:

It is ridiculous, yet here we are.
 
DAFlippers said:
The principle hasn't changed. No one can charge UK VAT unless they have a UK VAT number. Anyone saying they have to collect UK VAT that does not have a UK VAT number is talking out of their backside.

What happens if that company sends goods to Norway? They won't collect Norwegian VAT, the liability occurs at the border.

David
Click to expand...
Ok I take that back. If values less than £135 they have to charge VAT and if necessary register for VAT.

I should have known this government can make a complete and utter **** up of everything they touch.

Sorry for doubting.

David
 
If I am reading this correctly the VAT at point of sale outside the UK is only to be collected by the seller (e.g. GPE) if the value of the order is less than £135.

Edit: Posted above[emoji1] Probably introduced so the lazy ****d HMRC has less to do.

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Pooman2084 said:
It’s clear on the link above David.

Consignments valued at £135 or less​

The seller must charge and account for VAT at the point of sale, unless the consignment is a business to business sale and the customer has given them their UK VAT registration number.

To charge and account for VAT the seller will need to:

It is ridiculous, yet here we are.
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yep sorry I momentarily thought this one one thing the government couldn't screw up, silly me.

David
 
Andy_B said:
If I am reading this correctly the VAT at point of sale outside the UK is only to be collected by the seller (e.g. GPE) if the value of the order is less than £135.



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yep. ****shower isn't it?
 
Like any overseas supplier is going to jump through UK hoops to supply a poxy small order.

Probably cost them more to process it than they would generate in profit.

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In practical terms it could lead to minimum £135 orders into the UK to minimise hassle for the seller, but won’t we get stung for admin fees, VAT etc on parcels over £135?
 
When I spoke to Pinball Universe (ages ago), they told me that under their Stern license they were only allowed to supply to their own country. However, EU legislation states that they can't NOT serve a member of the EU (ie, restrict to a single market). Therefore if someone in the EU placed an order (for a new Stern pinball for example) they would have to accept it.

Now of course, they don't. Hence, from that conversation, to abide by their license agreement they can't sell to the UK. To other members of the EU yes, UK no.
 
Pooman2084 said:
In practical terms it could lead to minimum £135 orders into the UK to minimise hassle for the seller, but won’t we get stung for admin fees, VAT etc on parcels over £135?
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I think the Govt are trying to minimise missing out on VAT for small value shipments by getting sellers to register for UK VAT but if they register for UK VAT then why limit it to £135. The Govt have just not thought this through like everything else they do.

As it stands VAT and handling will be charged on anything over 135 as it enters UK and before it will be delivered to recipient.

David
 
So in summary as I read it, any business selling to UK customer has to charge UK VAT at the correct rate if the consignment is less than GBP135 and to do this they must register for UK VAT and complete UK VAT forms. If the value is greater than GBP135 then

Consignments valued at more than £135​

Normal VAT and customs rules will apply on importation of the goods into Great Britain from outside the UK or into Northern Ireland from outside the UK and EU.

Read VAT Notice 702 to find out more about how imported goods are treated for VAT purposes.

Of course Notice 702 is no longer valid so they have no idea what they should do.

This will apply to any business outside the UK.

I cannot see any non UK business selling anything to UK customers. What a complete **** up and apologies to all with my previous assertions that there were no changes.

David
 
This has been in discussion with a lot of our suppliers over recent weeks building up to this, I assumed it was common knowledge.

I am trying to bring bulk shipments of items in from manufacturers of items people want, but the truth is, I cannot order big bulk stock orders of extremely low moving items, as a business model it isn't viable. I am always looking to add products to the line though, so if there is a clear gap, please let me know. The support from this forum has been incredible, and there is a large shipment due of products which I think will increase sales, we are limited really at the moment to rubbers, LED's and pin gulps.

If there is something we can help with, let us know.
 
Can someone please clarify the following

re Pinball Universe. I understand they are in Germany and the trade deal between the EU and the UK was 'no barriers'?

Re GPE; does the £135 rule mean that China will have to collect VAT before it can ship to the UK? That's never going to happen.
What about other countries around the world but not in the EU; will they be collecting VAT on behalf of the UK Govt?
 
James said:
This has been in discussion with a lot of our suppliers over recent weeks building up to this, I assumed it was common knowledge.

I am trying to bring bulk shipments of items in from manufacturers of items people want, but the truth is, I cannot order big bulk stock orders of extremely low moving items, as a business model it isn't viable. I am always looking to add products to the line though, so if there is a clear gap, please let me know. The support from this forum has been incredible, and there is a large shipment due of products which I think will increase sales, we are limited really at the moment to rubbers, LED's and pin gulps.

If there is something we can help with, let us know.
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If you are UK registered then the seller does not have to register for UK VAT

Business to business sales to UK VAT-registered customers​

The seller will not need to charge and account for VAT if the customer gives them their VAT registration number. The seller can confirm it’s correct using the online service.

The seller can add a note to the invoice (for example, by writing ‘reverse charge: customer to account for VAT to HMRC’) then send it to the UK business customer.

The business customer will then be responsible for accounting for any VAT due on their VAT Return, if the goods are supplied in:

In both cases, the seller will be able to recover the VAT as input tax on the same VAT Return under normal VAT recovery rules.

Sellers do not have to register for VAT if they only sell goods that are outside the UK at the point of sale to UK VAT-registered businesses.
 
Gary Flower said:
Can someone please clarify the following

re Pinball Universe. I understand they are in Germany and the trade deal between the EU and the UK was 'no barriers'?

Re GPE; does the £135 rule mean that China will have to collect VAT before it can ship to the UK? That's never going to happen.
What about other countries around the world but not in the EU; will they be collecting VAT on behalf of the UK Govt?
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Hi Gary,

As I read it there is no duty but this VAT mess will make it nonsensical for non-UK companies to sell to non-UK registered customers. Pinball Universe sell Stern stuff to EU customers because EU permits that but as UK is not in EU they can't sell to UK as that breaches Stern distributor agreement.

Yes China and every other country will need to collect UK VAT.

Wonderfully well thought out policy isn't it?

David
 
Gary Flower said:
mean that China will have to collect VAT
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Here's a good example VAT added and the below displayed at AliExpress checkout

From 11PM 31 December 2020, AliExpress is required by law to collect UK Value-Added Tax (VAT) at the applicable rate and remit to the UK tax authority when goods are sold to UK customers (i) where the goods are located outside the UK at the point of sale with a consignment value of GBP135 or less, or (ii) where the goods are in the UK at the point of sale, but sold by an overseas seller. For more information, please visit: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/vat-and...using-online-marketplaces-from-1-january-2021
 
Gary Flower said:
Can someone please clarify the following

re Pinball Universe. I understand they are in Germany and the trade deal between the EU and the UK was 'no barriers
Click to expand...

That was the dream sold at the referendum. The reality is no quotas and no tariffs which is not the same as no barriers.
 
More paperwork.
A musician pal of mine who sells physical copies of his music all over the world has stopped for a few weeks to get all the new paperwork in order to export to Europe.

We have great suppliers in the uk. Perhaps they can boost the product ranges and we can support them.
 
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