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When should ukpinfest 2020 be held? Poll added

When should Pinfest 2020 be?

  • August bank holiday

    Votes: 30 44.8%

  • September (mid to late)

    Votes: 35 52.2%

  • Other month (please post)

    Votes: 2 3.0%
  • Total voters
    67
JMP said:
You obviously haven't stayed at Norbreck Castle Hotel in Blackpool for Play Expo Neil, now that is a dump ! I found the hotel to be largely fine, my room was clean, cool and big enough. Breakfast is OK, parking on site, two bars, Daventry pubs down the road, curry house etc. and only £60 a night including breakfast. Doesn't sound too bad to me.... not everyone has deep pockets for five star digs.
Click to expand...

Everything in Blackpool is a dump even the 5 star digs!

However, It’s nothing to do with money dood but everything to do with value.

I’ve stayed in cheaper better places but if you want to stick to some **** hole in the middle of nowhere that limits all the potential of the event it makes no odds to me!

Neil


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
OK, seeing as we're now talking about venues.....

It's all about balance. The closer you move to a city centre, the more expensive venues are. I did a little research last year. Looked at places around Birmingham and centrally. All costing far more than the Mercure at Daventry.

The beauty about this type of location is, everything is under one roof. You park up when you get there and don't have to leave until you're ready to go home. If you drive, that is.

Daventry isn't so bad. OK, it may not be ideally located and have the best transport links but we have everything under one roof and the costs are very attractive compared to other venues. We basically have the room hire for 5 days. Thursday through to Monday. Plus you have the bedrooms at fantastic rates. Thursday and Sunday nights are only £55 each B&B and the other two nights are £70 b&b - Other venues really struggle to compete with that. I'm really surprised more don't come for longer and make a family break of it. There are the facilities at the hotel and the country park is a short walk down the road.

Regarding the air conditioning.....It was hotter sitting in the corridor. Trust me, I was there most of the time. The suite was slightly cooler but it's stuffier as there is no air flow. You have to keep the doors closed for the air con to have a fighting chance. There are 100 machines and over 300 people in there. Of course it's not going to be ideal conditions unless we bring in some additional cooling systems. We also had to contend with the hottest August bank holiday ever.

But on the flip side, the nice weather brought the community together in the courtyard. It was fantastic seeing 50+ people sitting outside together socialising.

So, back to dates 🤣
 
I actually thought the Venue was fantastic. Ethan really enjoyed the swimming pool and playing football on the lawn with the goal at the front. Would have been a nice break on it's own, but with an amazing pinball event on top it was a fantastic weekend.
 
I stayed at the Ibis (about 15 minutes drive away) which was actually very good for the money I thought although it did prevent me from going to the evening sessions as I had my not so pinball loving partner to think of. If its held at the Mercure again next year I'll definitely book plenty of time in advance to not miss out on everything.

Whatever date it's held on you will never be able to please everybody so I guess it's a case of seeing what's convenient for most people. Might be worth starting a Poll?
 
Hi All

Just home and seen this. From what I get from Phill is:
He wants to keep the Venue and is just asking would a change of dates get more people in or not, as he has a break-even to make some profit model done with the Hotel. I myself think in might put the show under as he won't get
: Cheap venue for the show
: Cheap rooms for the customers
: Free rooms for the staff
: Free complementaries
Those items make this a little cheaper for him to run his show.

Phill asked me what I thought was good at the show and honestly, I said the craic was the highlight, not the comps not the pinballs (as I only played 9 games at the show 6 in UK finals)
But I think the question should have been what I thought should be done to make the show better (and for those that were there last year you would notice a lot of machines missing)
The fixes I think that should be made
1/ The layout of the pinball area was brutal (trying to fill the venue by with fewer machines and make it look full did not cut the ice.
the fix he needs more support from donators and not just a whack of EM's I'm sure there were 110 plus machines last year. It felt like 70 and take away 12 for never-ending silly comp so 60ish for people to play and a quarter of that was em and homebrew.
2/ No real spares and parts support or modders (1 guy selling a few bits in the main hall and what looked like a junkyard sale in the sides by 2 peeps over 2 days. Is that the height of Uk Pinball?
The fix get some real parts sellers from Europe and people in the USA (when I was in Texas I asked why they don't come I'm told was never asked.
3/ Competitions I played in 2 boycotted 1 because its a scam and a load of people agreed when I asked them I even heard some poor bloke sank a load of money in. the UK finals were well organised by Wayne and everybody knows I have no love for him but was a good job(and I played a stinker) but the machines only BM66 worked correctly indy500 (bad left flipper) bmtwd (lucky dip multiball) Dialed in and Indiana jones hud up. Guardians (not sure as it tilted my balls lol) and the last comp the Nba fastball if you were on left machine just shake your opponent's hand. Stall ball went down well and works thumbs up Neil
The fix don't use machines that don't work or at least test them before starting and come up with something that's fresh or that works in other countries.

Now the hotel issue's
I paid for my Hotel months ago and was charged again at the desk and given wrong room (king size over the twin I asked for) and now have to send my bank statement over to them so best all check.
AC anyone that knows AC their excuse of doors has to be closed or the ac shuts off until the door is closed knows that's bolix as it would damage the AC if on and of every few seconds it just did not work,
Bar closed and closing early and having to argue to get a drink and even no drink left to sell that's just bad business
Food in the lobby is just muck and crazy money.
Staff were really bad and slow and zero help.

Good points the craic with the 40 or so peeps in the smoking area lol bring on 2020
 
Last edited:
Big Phil said:
OK, seeing as we're now talking about venues.....

It's all about balance. The closer you move to a city centre, the more expensive venues are. I did a little research last year. Looked at places around Birmingham and centrally. All costing far more than the Mercure at Daventry.

The beauty about this type of location is, everything is under one roof. You park up when you get there and don't have to leave until you're ready to go home. If you drive, that is.

Daventry isn't so bad. OK, it may not be ideally located and have the best transport links but we have everything under one roof and the costs are very attractive compared to other venues. We basically have the room hire for 5 days. Thursday through to Monday. Plus you have the bedrooms at fantastic rates. Thursday and Sunday nights are only £55 each B&B and the other two nights are £70 b&b - Other venues really struggle to compete with that. I'm really surprised more don't come for longer and make a family break of it. There are the facilities at the hotel and the country park is a short walk down the road.

Regarding the air conditioning.....It was hotter sitting in the corridor. Trust me, I was there most of the time. The suite was slightly cooler but it's stuffier as there is no air flow. You have to keep the doors closed for the air con to have a fighting chance. There are 100 machines and over 300 people in there. Of course it's not going to be ideal conditions unless we bring in some additional cooling systems. We also had to contend with the hottest August bank holiday ever.

But on the flip side, the nice weather brought the community together in the courtyard. It was fantastic seeing 50+ people sitting outside together socialising.

So, back to dates 🤣
Click to expand...
They charged me £70 quid per night total of 210 @BigIan i know was the same
 
We’ll come along whenever it is. The weekend was so good I’ll build my other commitments around it! The only improvements would be cooler and more machines. The British climate may take care of the first of those next year...and ‘more machines’ means that people like me who don’t donate a machine will have to think again. Location and hotel were fine for me.Thanks again Phil.
 
Did my own research

2005 ? (Likely June or July as at Aston Villa and had to be in close season)
2006 end July Aston Villa
2007 end September Wicksteed Park
2008 end August Wicksteed Park
2009 end July Northampton Saints
2010 mid August (1st UK PP) Daventry
2011 mid August Daventry
2012 mid August Daventry
2013 mid August Daventry
2014 end August Daventry
2015 end August (1st in Wales)
2016 no show?
2017 no show?

So it does seem that it has traditionally been summer, but as it’s an indoor event, I do think it loses footfall because people are disinclined to spend time indoors or are holidaying.
 
Atlantis said:
Hi All

Just home and seen this. From what I get from Phill is:
He wants to keep the Venue and is just asking would a change of dates get more people in or not, as he has a break-even to make some profit model done with the Hotel and I myself think he might end up having to start fresh might put the show under as he won't get
: Cheap venue for the show
: Cheap rooms for the customers
: Free rooms for the staff
: Free complementaries
Those items make this a little cheaper for him to run his show.

Phill asked me what I thought was good at the show and honestly, I said the craic was the highlight, not the comps not the pinballs (as I only played 9 games at the show 6 in UK finals)
But I think the question should have been what I thought should be done to make the show better (and for those that were there last year you would notice a lot of machines missing)
The fixes I think that should be made
1/ The layout of the pinball area was brutal (trying to fill the venue by with fewer machines and make it look full did not cut the ice.
the fix he needs more support from donators and not just a whack of EM's I'm sure there were 110 plus machines last year. It felt like 70 and take away 12 for never-ending silly comp so 60ish for people to play and a quarter of that was em and homebrew.
2/ No real spares and parts support or modders (1 guy selling a few bits in the main hall and what looked like a junkyard sale in the sides by 2 peeps over 2 days. Is that the height of Uk Pinball?
The fix get some real parts sellers from Europe and people in the USA (when I was in Texas I asked why they don't come I'm told was never asked.
3/ Competitions I played in 2 boycotted 1 because its a scam and a load of people agreed when I asked them I even heard some poor bloke sank a load of money in. the UK finals were well organised by Wayne and everybody knows I have no love for him but was a good job(and I played a stinker) but the machines only BM66 worked correctly indy500 (bad left flipper) bmtwd (lucky dip multiball) Dialed in and Indiana jones hud up. Guardians (not sure as it tilted my balls lol) and the last comp the Nba fastball if you were on left machine just shake your opponent's hand. Stall ball went down well and works thumbs up Neil
The fix don't use machines that don't work or at least test them before starting and come up with something that's fresh or that works in other countries.

Now the hotel issue's
I paid for my Hotel months ago and was charged again at the desk and given wrong room (king size over the twin I asked for) and now have to send my bank statement over to them so best all check.
AC anyone that knows AC their excuse of doors has to be closed or the ac shuts off until the door is closed knows that's bolix as it would damage the AC if on and of every few seconds it just did not work,
Bar closed and closing early and having to argue to get a drink and even no drink left to sell that's just bad business
Food in the lobby is just muck and crazy money.
Staff were really bad and slow and zero help.

Good points the craic with the 40 or so peeps in the smoking area lol bring on 2020
Click to expand...


're Pin numbers next year, no problem I know a mad Irish guy who said he could bring pins next year, and a mad cockney guy who said he would match the pin pledge x 3 IIRC.
So there's 120😀

Layout made sense based on what was there.If more local people pledge the better, cos about 15% were pledged from people with round trip journeys of 12 hours plus.
Bar, yup needs work, tho Liz helped out with that, tho all ironic as they probably lost 500 quid plus due to that crap
Parts, yes would love more personally just don't see it happening.

Socially tho it was frickin AWESOME
 
Hi just wanted to point out @Atlantis 3rd point about the competition

Scoring can vary widely from game to game and player to player whist one attempt might be lousy the second attempt on the same game could yield better results.

Can’t comment on if the main comp was a scam but with unlimited qualifying attempts it can be very easy to go a bit overboard.

Maybe the format could be revised to give credit to well played games whilst cancelling out the low scoring ones.

Those of us who took part in the uk classics competition would have seen that format at work.

How was the format run at last years pinfest? (Out of interest)


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Big Phil said:
To be honest, footfall isn’t really an issue for the size of the venue and the amount of machines. Back to balance and I think we’ve found a happy medium there.

I guess I’m just trying to please everyone and that just can’t happen.
Click to expand...

No worries key thing is that this years event was a success!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I think daventry is perfect location is probably the best you could ask for 10 mins drive from the m1 and good for people coming from London or up north
Hotel is more than adequate and reasonably priced I much prefer to be housed at the venue rather than to commute back and forth like we do at nlp shows but cheeper options are available if you want
Things to do again all good for me swimming pool gym restaurant a short walk to good local pud that serves food also Tesco express never been to the Center so can’t comment on that
Transport yes not that great but let’s be honest how many people actually commute to an event one massive winner that works for me is that you can park your van in the car park for free and come and go as you choose one big turn off for me is when you can’t park near the venue in a van and again lots of donators are in vans this years nlp event cost me £25 to park
Another thing is that phil now knows all the ins and outs of running an event here which must make life much easier
Anyway back to the date sept Oct I would say best for me
 
I agree with everything said on here by everyone. Daventry is only central in the UK if you dont happen to live past the top of wales, but again agree it's only 10 mins off M1 and an easy drive (even tho it is 200 miles for us) if there wasnt bank holiday traffic - Leeds festival was a big delay for us as M1 was grid locked at A64 junction so cost us another hour. Big plus for gig at the same venue though - saves a lot of hassle ferrying to and from shows and free parking a big plus.

Pins in the 2 middles rows could have been closer to togther to make more space around the outside. For me personally was too hot in there and comps hogged a lot of machines so I played most of my games on sunday night after the packdown!!

Best part of the weekend for us was meeting all the guys again (new and old) and the social craic - priceless ( espcially poibugs juggling act!)

Phil a fantastic job again though, and I hope you find this purely as constructive criticism from me, as you know I am a big supporter of all the shows and always donate a pin when I can.

Heres to next year where ever and when ever it may be !!

Cheers

kev
 
Daventry is a fine venue. It is very unlikely that we will see a Bank Holiday weekend that hot again in our lifetime.
With the amount of machines available for general public to play over the event, surely more footfall wasn't required which would have increased waiting times especially for those rare and desireable new models.
More machines and more footfall is fine, I don't mind waiting 5-10 minutes for a machine to free up but waiting any longer would put me off attending in the future.
Hanging around waiting for a machine to free up any longer in Saturday's heat would have been hell if there were many more visitors.
Bank Holiday weekend gets my vote though.
 
Tombyrne said:
Daventry is a fine venue. It is very unlikely that we will see a Bank Holiday weekend that hot again in our lifetime.
With the amount of machines available for general public to play over the event, surely more footfall wasn't required which would have increased waiting times especially for those rare and desireable new models.
More machines and more footfall is fine, I don't mind waiting 5-10 minutes for a machine to free up but waiting any longer would put me off attending in the future.
Hanging around waiting for a machine to free up any longer in Saturday's heat would have been hell if there were many more visitors.
Bank Holiday weekend gets my vote though.
Click to expand...

The Record Bank Holiday temperature was set just two years ago and was then beaten this past weekend.

I will bet you a pinball machine it is broken again in the next 5 years! :p

I am being selfish, as a I cannot ever make the Bank Holiday weekend, but surely with it being an indoor activity, it is more suited to colder months........

September / October also gets my vote!
 
thelab said:
As long as it doesn't clash with EPC or the Belgium Open, September/October could work.

But I do appreciate this is an event for all, not just those who like to play in competitions.
Click to expand...

Yeah but a lot of the organisers play in those competitions - so it does matter.

September looks possible, October a non-starter with several large events in October.

I’d also like to see the UK Open back at the event to attract the biggest field for the competition and have more overseas folks join the event.

The temperature needs consideration, couple of more degrees and you’d start to see the games be affected (which is why we put in temp A/C during the open). And I do think we will see as hot temps again.

Cheers,
Neil.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
Daventry works for me !!

Pin Numbers. I felt the room could take more pins, it was baggy. But Phil said on the donation thread that he had enough donations and closed the list. Did some not show? Was it felt space was not there? I think that room can definitely handle another 20 machines.

Space. What would be the extra cost of using a side room for traders? Or a second zone where you can talk to exhibitors like the home brew guys, or parts people. Maybe add in some of the quieter games. Parts / Em room maybe.

League. Maybe hold that in a separate room. I don’t know all the logistics of how the competition works but having a line of 6 good machines with 5 switched off and one being played just looks plain BAD to the paying guests. In the earlier stages it was fine when they were all in use.

Parts. I chose not to bring parts this year due the the huge amount of stuff to move to bring a full range. I may bring a scaled down shop next year. I also thought that I’d be needed to do more repairs, but the reliability of machines seems to much better nowadays, and more techs on hand so may have more time to do parts. Again I think parts could be in a side room, which would also give us some better security for when the shop owners want to take a break or are absent in the later sessions.

All in all so much better organised under the new management. Liked that staff were there early to get people wrist banded ready to steam in on opening.
 
I like the bank holiday as a date, its far enough in advance that everyone will know about it, you're never going to be able to get a date that suits everyone.

It was pretty hot, but I didn't find it unbearable to be honest and I'm not a fan of heat!

I think the location is pretty good for the show as it stands, it's pretty much get-to-able in a reasonable drive from anywhere in the UK.
I do get that if you didn't drive it could be pretty difficult.

Most people I assume are there to play pinball, drink beer, catch up with people and frankly aslong as the rooms are made of a solid structure and had a vertical surface to sleep on and are clean wouldn't mind too much, especially at the price.

I think any change of venue would need some thought, if it was a nicer hotel/closer to a city then maybe you'd get more non-pinball family members along to make a weekend of it - but would you actually want this or would you end up with a kind of split weekend where the non-pinball members would expect you to spend half the weekend doing other things as they're not interested in 2 solid days of pinball.
Larger venue - great, more games, but more games to look after, more space required to house them and more punters needed to make it economic.
If you need more punters to make it work, you require non-pinball people to get involved and come along. (A good thing for sure, but not as easy to rely on in terms of it happening - how big is the demand for a show outside the confines of the pinball community?)

I'd rather have a fun event where is a pleasure for both the people who go AND the people that run it, if it gets bigger then the organisational side gets bigger too and there comes a point when it's a nightmare to organise.
Sometimes a smaller scale event that knows what it's about is a better thing than a huge unwieldy event that tries to be all things to all people and looses its focus

I'd happily return on the same dates at the same place.

Maybe have a poll on who went and who didn't and who would have gone if it wasn't the BH weekend?

A room for traders would be a good thing though.
 
pinballmania said:
Daventry works for me !!

Pin Numbers. I felt the room could take more pins, it was baggy. But Phil said on the donation thread that he had enough donations and closed the list. Did some not show? Was it felt space was not there? I think that room can definitely handle another 20 machines.

Space. What would be the extra cost of using a side room for traders? Or a second zone where you can talk to exhibitors like the home brew guys, or parts people. Maybe add in some of the quieter games. Parts / Em room maybe.

League. Maybe hold that in a separate room. I don’t know all the logistics of how the competition works but having a line of 6 good machines with 5 switched off and one being played just looks plain BAD to the paying guests. In the earlier stages it was fine when they were all in use.

Parts. I chose not to bring parts this year due the the huge amount of stuff to move to bring a full range. I may bring a scaled down shop next year. I also thought that I’d be needed to do more repairs, but the reliability of machines seems to much better nowadays, and more techs on hand so may have more time to do parts. Again I think parts could be in a side room, which would also give us some better security for when the shop owners want to take a break or are absent in the later sessions.

All in all so much better organised under the new management. Liked that staff were there early to get people wrist banded ready to steam in on opening.
Click to expand...

Andy - many thanks for help with a few of my games that had problems.

Cheers
Neil.


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ChrisH said:
I like the bank holiday as a date, its far enough in advance that everyone will know about it, you're never going to be able to get a date that suits everyone.

It was pretty hot, but I didn't find it unbearable to be honest and I'm not a fan of heat!

I think the location is pretty good for the show as it stands, it's pretty much get-to-able in a reasonable drive from anywhere in the UK.
I do get that if you didn't drive it could be pretty difficult.

Most people I assume are there to play pinball, drink beer, catch up with people and frankly aslong as the rooms are made of a solid structure and had a vertical surface to sleep on and are clean wouldn't mind too much, especially at the price.

I think any change of venue would need some thought, if it was a nicer hotel/closer to a city then maybe you'd get more non-pinball family members along to make a weekend of it - but would you actually want this or would you end up with a kind of split weekend where the non-pinball members would expect you to spend half the weekend doing other things as they're not interested in 2 solid days of pinball.
Larger venue - great, more games, but more games to look after, more space required to house them and more punters needed to make it economic.
If you need more punters to make it work, you require non-pinball people to get involved and come along. (A good thing for sure, but not as easy to rely on in terms of it happening - how big is the demand for a show outside the confines of the pinball community?)

I'd rather have a fun event where is a pleasure for both the people who go AND the people that run it, if it gets bigger then the organisational side gets bigger too and there comes a point when it's a nightmare to organise.
Sometimes a smaller scale event that knows what it's about is a better thing than a huge unwieldy event that tries to be all things to all people and looses its focus
Click to expand...

Some valid points here Chris.

The location is important for me as I often have non-pinball family members with me who want something to do - Daventry doesn’t cut it for that unfortunately.

what is this events purpose is a crucial question - is it for the community - in which case probably doesn’t matter when or where you have it as long as it doesn’t clash with any other big pinball community events which puts October out. If it’s to promote pinball then both the location and date is a problem in my view. Daventry doesn’t even have a train station and the nearest one doesn’t even have a taxi rank!

Agree with Andy a few more machines would have fitted but also think the comps needs to be in the main hall.



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Main completion fine as it’s an open event. The league finals are closed and could be held anywhere imo. If it is to be in the main hall then fine but visitors should be told why the machines are off. Looks bad.

If they’re in a separate area then no one is going to mind that they’re off, and more room in the hall for machines for the Public.
 
pinballmania said:
Main completion fine as it’s an open event. The league finals are closed and could be held anywhere imo. If it is to be in the main hall then fine but visitors should be told why the machines are off. Looks bad.

If they’re in a separate area then no one is going to mind that they’re off, and more room in the hall for machines for the Public.
Click to expand...

I agree Andy - I think the league fjnals being the biggest event in the UK pinball schedule needs more love at the finals and more generally - I super agree that some signage for the areas would help a lot. Although I watched some guy move the barrier then pile into the comp area and almost start playing IMDN - fortunately we stopped him before he ruined a game that was in


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The Air Con in the main room is not working.
You can hear a rumble of the AHU, but no air flow.
Reasons for this,
Vee belts on unit snapped
Fire dampers dropped (Thermal link snapped)
Blocked air filters, pre and main. If not changed on a regular basis, the Heating and Cooling batteries will be blocked too.
Corridor fan coil units were switched off.
Setpoints need to be changed(lowered) as the venue holds Weddings.
The A/C was working in the Restaurant though.
 
Both Phil and Wayne have check out many venues more central to public transport / big cities and the cost is prohibitive. I always thought the paragon hotel in birmingham was ideal until l saw the venue hire rates! If Daventry is set as the venue i cant see an issue with a September show . October would clash with too many events. They also need to get the room booking confusion sorted . With our new pub only 14 weeks old l didnt want to leave it looking too sparse this year . Next year l should have no problem bringing more including the 3 games folks like to see MB MM and AFM
 
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