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UK Pinball League 2024 - Feedback

Wizcat

Wizcat

Registered
10 Years
Joined
Sep 9, 2011
Messages
1,843
Location
Lancashire
We introduced a few significant changes this year, such as Regional Finals, based on feedback from some of the regions in previous seasons. I'd like to hear thoughts about the changes that were introduced, and any positives or negatives with your experience as a whole, so that the regional coordinators (who ultimately make the decisions, along with myself) can continue to best serve the community. This can include feedback from those who for whatever reason have not participated in the local leagues - I'd love to know if there are reasons why not!

Feedback is welcome here in the thread of course, but I'm also open to PMs if you've got gripes that you'd prefer not to make public. I'm sure the regional coordinators are equally open to feedback if you prefer to address them privately too.

I'll be sending emails to the regional coordinators separately in due course to discuss some of the feedback that will come up too, but this thread is probably the best place to seek feedback or suggestions from the community as a whole.

Thanks :)
 
This also might be a good place to say thanks to Pete @PAZ who made a significant contribution behind the scenes this year in helping me standardise how league meet results are submitted into the database. Cheers Pete. I still owe you beer :)
 
My only comments are that I was switching between first and second place with Matt Vince meets 1 to 5 and meet 6 hadn't been announced. It got announced within 2 weeks I think of the meet which I couldn't make and found out there was going to be playoffs for position on the last meet for the first time. I think this determined the overall final positions which seemed extremely unfair. I may be completely wrong here and apologies if I am but if that was the case, me making meets 1 - 5 seemed pointless.

Anyhow, no Biggy. It's only pinball.
 
SW was well organised, a couple of months’ notice of each meet and the venues and machines were great. Organised as a set of tournaments with top 2 overall going through, rather than having a separate “finals” meet. This seems fairer than a separate finals meet which some would inevitably be unavailable for.

10/10 would flip again
 
My feedback:
Northern league very well organised with full schedule published well before the first league meet - so all 6 meets plus the final dates were known well in advance.

There is disparity between regions on how many games are played at each meet. I’d suggest this should be made consistent. In the N league the length of some meets were a bit long with 12,13,14 games etc. Personally 6 - 8 seems about right for me.

Attendance price: £5 is way too cheap IMHO, so please increase that and perhaps standardize the cost across the country too?
 
My main concern is fitting 30 head to head games in from 2 to 7 plus finals before the start of the Pinfest playoffs and also having time to eat in between. Would be nice to have time to socialise over a pint and pub meal Sat eve as one of the highlights of the weekend for me it appreciate can't always have everything.

Can't see it all finished in time without possibly clashing with knockout rounds in main comp for some.

Is there any plan in event of such a clash?
 
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AlanJ said:
My feedback:
Northern league very well organised with full schedule published well before the first league meet - so all 6 meets plus the final dates were known well in advance.

There is disparity between regions on how many games are played at each meet. I’d suggest this should be made consistent. In the N league the length of some meets were a bit long with 12,13,14 games etc. Personally 6 - 8 seems about right for me.

Attendance price: £5 is way too cheap IMHO, so please increase that and perhaps standardize the cost across the country too?
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Maybe cap the maximum games from 15 down a bit
 
I don’t want this to sound like sour grapes but I didn’t really bother with the last 2 seasons. Think I did two meets in 2023 and just 1 in 2024.

The SE league had lost a lot of its momentum. For the first time in 10 (?) seasons I didn’t put my name forward to host this year as it seemed a lot of effort for under 20 players.

Hopefully Diane is going to be able to revitalise it. Having the dates published so far in advance is a massive plus. 8+ games is probably a good thing but it’s then going to limit the amount of people who can host.

All things need to change over time.
 
Had fun (if not as much luck) in the league, also like the ‘lots of little tournaments’ format, big thanks @Moonraker for organising SW meets - £5 is great value for a day of pinball, not fussed on the price - as a host don’t think I was out of pocket when it came to food. Perhaps go up a few % only with inflation if needs be?

Last year I got into the finals but it did leave little time for the main comp/classics otherwise.

Good luck all those who got through to the finals! Go’wan @robotgreg / Josh for the win!
 
I liked it. Midlands league was fun and liked how different regions had autonomy to do what was best/what they felt like doing. Personally I'm not fussed, I enjoy any format and will play/do play anything and everything.

@robotgreg psh... socialising. No time for that, this is serious business, give us 90 games! Let's go @mufcmufc ! Midlands bringing this one home!

Thanks @PAZ unsung HERO
 
GezTheHealer said:
Had fun (if not as much luck) in the league, also like the ‘lots of little tournaments’ format, big thanks @Moonraker for organising SW meets - £5 is great value for a day of pinball, not fussed on the price - as a host don’t think I was out of pocket when it came to food. Perhaps go up a few % only with inflation if needs be?
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At the present time the South West pay more to the host (£5 per person rather than £2 per person) than other areas, which is why you didn't feel out of pocket...
 
I attended all of the new East Anglian league events, and didn't know what to expect, but all of them were an absolute hoot. It's amazing to see what fantastic collections folk have around the East, and clearly how much they enjoyed opening them up to a great gang of keen yet respectful players. They should all be commended for their generosity and hospitality. @Lecari and @David_Vi did an amazing job, as always, organising, TDing and helping out with technical issues. I thought the format worked well and didn't take too long each time, so some could get home early if they had to, and there was time afterwards for the diehards to play some more fun formats like strikes and split flipper. All a roaring success from my POV.
 
I'm sure @Lecari will know the numbers more than I do but in our EA league the entry was around £10, so hosts were getting £8 per person which I think is good.

Not knowing what other regions are like, I may not be qualified to say, but I think our region has been a huge success.

We've had between 20-30 attendees at each meet. Played between 8-10 games, which seems a decent amount considering people travel for the meets and on 3 of the meets we had a bonus comp to help newbies get a taste of competitive pinball and some wpprs under their belt, or in some cases a fun non IFPA ranked split flipper comp 😄

I know if we had more than 30 attendees we'd struggle finding suitable hosts. So to me 20-25 is the sweet spot for a decent league meet without it being too busy or a host not having the space.
 
The success of the EAPA is down to the hard work and determination of Claire and David. Getting not only enough venues which could host, but to then have the tables set up to competition standard was incredible. Along with my daughter, we have been welcomed into this new hobby by all and now look forward to bigger competitions as a direct result of being in the regional league of East Anglia. Having mini comps after the league has also helped the rivalry amongst a regular 20+ who attend at least 4 of the meets. NAT and PAZ will do us proud at Pinfest.
 
As a total noob to pinball in January this year and not knowing what to expect at all, I was made very welcome by the EA league group at all of the meets.
Even though my scores (at the moment) are consistently at the bottom end of the results table, I am not disheartened. The variation of pins, venues, formats and extra games, as well as the comraderie, are what have given me the pinball bug and keeps me coming back for more...I now already have my own pin at home!
I was amazed at being told that up till recently the EA league was not viable. The group are always extremely keen and committed, with a big shout out to @Lecari and @David_Vi at the helm with their infectious enthusiasm, bringing the group together and doing the organisational legwork. Also to the hosts for opening up their homes and fantastic collections: @Jmac, @marcgatward, Geoff, Gaz plus the PinHaus again with @Lecari and @David_Vi.
Definitely looking forward to the next league year. Go EAPA!
 
robotgreg said:
...
Can't see it all finished in time without possibly clashing with knockout rounds in main comp for some.

Is there any plan in event of such a clash?
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Sorry, should have mentioned - all single ball games

Joking aside, it's a fair point that has stressed me out too. Could change it to a single set of 15 round robin games, but player order will be randomised.

If competitors feel strongly either way about it then drop me a pm. More time or more randomness.
 
Wizcat said:
Sorry, should have mentioned - all single ball games

Joking aside, it's a fair point that has stressed me out too. Could change it to a single set of 15 round robin games, but player order will be randomised.

If competitors feel strongly either way about it then drop me a pm. More time or more randomness.
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Think that would work better IMO and should be able to make it so that more or less even number of player 1s and 2s per person
 
£5 is too little to pay. It should increase so that host costs are fully covered.

I like 15 game session of Northern League:
1. Results are more consistent. Less chance to get a few lucky games or mess up a few that have big impact on overall result.
2. Time to do 6 or 7 games is almost as much as 15 as you just hang around more often waiting for a machine to become available when there are fewer machines.
3. I travel a long way to attend Northern League (120 miles 2.5 to 3 jours each way). I probably wouldn't bother if there was always fewer.machines.
4. But where there are 15 machines it need to include some older machines with shorter game times.
5. I like the variety of games and being able to play a variety of machines from 1960s to current day. I have been attending Northern League for 3 years /18 sessions and have played 203 games on 104 different machines. Fabulous.
 
Maybe keep the game numbers, as already mentioned it's not likely to speed the day up just make more waiting groups, but how about changing the number or balls down to 3 instead of 4? That would save a bit of time.

I've got a similar situation to asiapinball as well, some rounds are 2+ hours drive for me and none under an hour, so limiting the game numbers might effect my attendance.

What about starting the northern an hour earlier as well to stop it running too late? Is it 1pm we start at the moment?
 
A bit (well, it turned into a lot) of feedback from an ex London/SE league attendee, and new East Anglia participant...

Firstly, and apologies for this, but a bit of a moan about the London/SE league...
I totally agree with @johnwhitfield in his post above. Over the past few years I'd become quite disillusioned with the London/SE league. A major part of this was the hard limit of only 6 games included in the league meets, despite significantly more machines being used in other league regions. This never changed, and the suggestion of increasing the number of games was met with a stubborn refusal to even consider the idea when I discussed it with the organiser on more than one occasion. I had no problem with only 6 machines if it was kindly hosted by someone who only had 6 or 7 machines, but it was, quite frankly, ridiculous to only play 6 machines when a league meet was held at PBR with 50+ machines, or other hosts with large numbers of machines available. This was especially galling if one had a long distance to travel to only play 6 games.

The other main issue I had with the SE league was that dates for events were released inconsistently, and much, much later than other leagues - often after 1 or more league meets had already happened in other areas. This quite often meant that by the time the dates were released in a piecemeal fashion, I had other engagements already booked in my diary, which I would have arranged on other days had the league dates been released in a timely manner. There is no reason that league dates should/could not be arranged and made available at least at the start of the year, as happens in other regions. Surely this would have been more convenient for the hosts as well?

I understand that @Diane B will be taking over organising the London/SE league for next season, and have every confidence she will address both the above issues, which hopefully should help see the revitalisation of this region.

East Anglia League
Well, what can I say - what a contrast to London/SE!
This was the first year for this new region, and it has been absolutely brilliant. Several people kindly kindly opened up their homes to host a pinball event for the very first time. All were superb, and I was very grateful to be able to attend all but one of the league meets, in addition to the final held yesterday.
The organisation has been superb by @Lecari and @David_Vi and the standard of the venues and the food/refreshments provided has been top-notch - well worth the £10 fee, often with home made curries, cheesecake etc..
At each of the meets there have generally been 8-10 machines in the competition, but in addition to the league, at most events, there has also been organised an additional competition run after the league, very much with the ethos that WPPRs are not important (although some were IFPA registered), but totally focussed on having fun and socialising (split flipper, strikes etc..). Given this league didn't exist in previous years, the number of hosts and players who have emerged from nowhere is remarkable, and many new players are now interested in other competitions after their positive initial experience at the EA league.
I'd also like to mention one thing that I think is unique to the EA league, which I certainly found helpful, was that on the UK Pinball website, on the pages for scheduled events, not only was there the usual list of machines to be used, but also helpful links to the rulesets and tutorial and video streams featuring the machines. I know it's possible to google this info yourself, but having the links there was great - maybe something to consider for other regions?
In summary, Claire, David, all the hosts, and the people who have attended have made the inaugural EA league a resounding success.

Good luck to Nathan and Pete in the finals, but, as a comitted PBR member, good luck also to Lucy and Matt! 👍 :)
 
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AlanJ said:
I’ve always been surprised there isn’t a league further north centered around Newcastle.
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I don't think there are quite enough of us up here to host. I have 9 machines set up in the house but it's too cramped for a league meeting. 2 rows facing each other with just enough room to get the glass off. Others that I have been to are in similar position. Getting 6 hosts in a season would be a challenge. The population of the far north is sparse so you just don't get the numbers.
 
Asiapinball said:
I don't think there are quite enough of us up here to host. I have 9 machines set up in the house but it's too cramped for a league meeting. 2 rows facing each other with just enough room to get the glass off. Others that I have been to are in similar position. Getting 6 hosts in a season would be a challenge. The population of the far north is sparse so you just don't get the numbers.
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Aha. Fair enough.

picking up on @Arv ’s point. The spread across the north of England from hull to southport is a pretty big area - maybe it should be split. I’d be a lot happier hosting 20-25 rather than 45 and I’d then be happier with more games played.
 
Although a smaller geographic area London and the SE might be worth sub dividing. At one time we were getting 40+ people to a meet which was hard to handle (I can only do it if the weather is fine).

Also travel time involving anything going across London is simply horrific.
 
johnwhitfield said:
Although a smaller geographic area London and the SE might be worth sub dividing. At one time we were getting 40+ people to a meet which was hard to handle (I can only do it if the weather is fine).
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It effectively did last year, with the other contingent moving to the East Anglia League, which mirrored South West and a contingent moving to South Wales League. Quite freaky the similarity in numbers London &SE (35) with South West (31) and the new regions - East Anglia (45) and South Wales (53).
 
C&C said:
I'd also like to mention one thing that I think is unique to the EA league, which I certainly found helpful, was that on the UK Pinball website, on the pages for scheduled events, not only was there the usual list of machines to be used, but also helpful links to the rulesets and tutorial and video streams featuring the machines. I know it's possible to google this info yourself, but having the links there was great - maybe something to consider for other regions?
Click to expand...

Glad someone appreciated this :D It is available to all regions, but it does rely on the organisers (or hosts directly if that's easier) giving me a list of games ahead of schedule.

Whilst here I'll also just mention that I'm thumbing a lot of these posts just as appreciation for the feedback, and it shouldn't be construed that I'm in agreement with the points made necessarily :)
 
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