What's new
By:
Pinball info

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Themes that (always) produce good/bad pins?

VeeMonroe

VeeMonroe

Registered
Joined
Aug 4, 2021
Messages
2,641
Location
London
Not sure how we got onto this topic, but @MadMonzer had a theory that any pin with an aquatic theme was always good. We had a look on Pinside to test this out, and it appears to hold up with the notable exception of Waterworld… and anything to do with pirates.

Putting on my flameproof underwear, but Jaws, Fish Tales and Fathom are all great and themed around water.

As soon as you add pirates, e.g. Stern Pirates of the Caribbean, Hook and (IMO) Black Rose, the pin sinks deep below the waves. Not sure why that is, but it’s possibly due to the focus on cannons as a main mechanic (the crossbow is the worse bit of The Walking Dead).

Science fiction, especially aliens, also seems to create consistently good pins.

Just wondered if anyone else had noticed this? And whether there are any trends in themes that I’ve missed…
 
Oooh good question, I think the battle mechanic lends itself well to aliens, high stakes save the earth, easy to understand the objective. Following on from that any big monsters (can dinosaurs be included as monsters) works well in that respect.
But my vote goes to circus/magic themes, TOM, CV, Pinball Magic, Funhouse, Houdini is debatable, probably a bit let down by Hurricane, but more hits than misses.

On the flip side, its always surprises me how badly ball sports translate to pins, well modern ones anyway, it should be a ready baked concept to scale down. The old EM designers seemed to make it work.
 
Despite disliking football WCS is a great game. One of the few I regret selling. Can’t think of any other fun sports based games.

I was going to say Science Fiction stuff translates into good games but then remembered Star Wars.

Superhero stuff works but has now been done way too much.

And just to show it’s great that we all have different tastes. I can’t think of a single magic based game that I’d rate. I’ve had a couple and disliked them intensely. Same goes for anything with a novelty based head on the playfield. Funhouse, roadshow, t3. 🤮
 
johnwhitfield said:
Despite disliking football WCS is a great game. One of the few I regret selling. Can’t think of any other fun sports based games.
Click to expand...

WCS is the only football-themed pin I can think of (probably best I haven't played the others) and it's ace!

There are a lot of fun basketball-themed pins (basketball is a popular theme for pins, I've noticed), but only NBA Fastbreak actually *feels* like basketball. I personally have a soft spot for Harlem Globetrotters (or 'trotters' as it gets called in our house) and Super Loops, but either could be rethemed to any other theme.

Stern NBA is a turkey...

johnwhitfield said:
I was going to say Science Fiction stuff translates into good games but then remembered Star Wars.
Click to expand...

Stern Star Wars is good.

DE Star Wars has two shots worth making, but I played it in Prague and learned to light it up. And I always play it on location now just for the music/lightshow. @Big Phil's DE Star Wars developed a fault at Pinfest that gave me an endless multiball and, honestly, it couldn't have happened to a better machine (or multiball) - it was an epic pinball event!

johnwhitfield said:
Superhero stuff works but has now been done way too much.
Click to expand...
Yes, although I find the Stern Spike 2 ones are a bit bland and the only pre-Stern one I can think of, off the top of my head, is The Shadow - which, admittedly, is a stone-cold classic.

johnwhitfield said:
And just to show it’s great that we all have different tastes. I can’t think of a single magic based game that I’d rate. I’ve had a couple and disliked them intensely. Same goes for anything with a novelty based head on the playfield. Funhouse, roadshow, t3. 🤮
Click to expand...

I don't like any of the magic-based pinball machines, either. Other people rate them, so they're evidently objectively good, but I don't get it. It seems to be about the art direction, containing magnets, and being designed by John Popadiuk.

The novelty heads can be creepy, but - again - the pins tend to be objectively highly rated. The only outlier is, possibly, No Fear, but that's pretty good. People like KISS (which also has a novelty head if T2/3 do)...
 
VeeMonroe said:
Hook ... sinks deep below the waves.
Click to expand...

How dare you!

I'm going to sing some praises for Hook for a moment.

Firstly just consider that it's an early 90s Dataeast which although wasn't the lowest moment in their life (see Showcase) it was just before they found their feet with JP, LW3, LAH etc (but only then because they ripped off WMS tech & design ... ANYWAY.. good for us as it turns out)

Hook.

Started life as a Themepark before they failed to get a license from Universal, so the rollercoaster became a windcoaster. Genius or good luck..

The key to enjoying this game is to play it at home. If you can't hear the music it's trash.

Why is the music so good? Simples.. Brian Schmidt scored it.

When you start a game you get this soundbite from Toodles whispering "got to fly, got to crow ... got to find peter .. find jack .. HOOK IS BAAACK" and brilliantly gentle background music that youd never expect to hear on a DE pin.

Lulls you into a yawn fest.

Then you launch.

Schmidt reverts to type with a ridiculously crafted baseline and a tempo increase of about 500%... as you might expect. Hi-hat smashing the limiter.
The melody of horns superb. There's something about the instruments that he synth'ed on that BSMT chip that is unlike anything else.

It's punchy and straight from the movie. Then it breaks into these chords, same instrument but played like a piano, before looping back.

The reason you have to play it in person is because if you attempt to listen to this is a crowed pub, at low volume, or even on youtube, you just don't hear the phase effects.

The best thing DE ever did was develop a stereo sound system. Schmidt quickly realised that stereo panning and separation was reasonable but the best effects were heard through phasing. Almost all of his tracks have phase effects in them which is why you can only really appriciate them in person on the real hardware.

The best example of this in Hook is the jackpot reward music. If you happen to have the machine turned up loud it's like nothing you've ever heard before. Fills the room and it's like some of the sounds are even coming from behind you. For 1991 it's wild.

TAF in comparison is flat and 1-dimensional, but has the ruleset.

Anyway, my point is don't let a simple ruleset define how good a pin is. Hook is a masterpiece and if you want to step up to a pin and have a 30 minute jackpot fest, pretty much off the bat, it's brilliant.
 
Last edited:
strobey said:
How dare you!

I'm going to sing some praises for Hook for a moment.

Firstly just consider that it's an early 90s Dataeast which although wasn't the lowest moment in their life (see Showcase) it was just before they found their feet with JP, LW3, LAH etc (but only then because they ripped off WMS tech & design ... ANYWAY.. good for us as it turns out)

Hook.

Started life as a Themepark before they failed to get a license from Universal, so the rollercoaster became a windcoaster. Genius or good luck..

The key to enjoying this game is to play it at home. If you can't hear the music it's trash.

Why is the music so good? Simples.. Brian Schmidt scored it.

When you start a game you get this soundbite from Toodles whispering "got to fly, got to crow ... got to find peter .. find jack .. HOOK IS BAAACK" and brilliantly gentle background music that youd never expect to hear on a DE pin.

Lulls you into a yawn fest.

Then you launch.

Schmidt reverts to type with a ridiculously crafted baseline and a tempo increase of about 500%... as you might expect. Hi-hat smashing the limiter.
The melody of horns superb. There's something about the instruments that he synth'ed on that BSMT chip that is unlike anything else.

It's punchy and straight from the movie. Then it breaks into these chords, same instrument but played like a piano, before looping back.

The reason you have to play it in person is because if you attempt to listen to this is a crowed pub, at low volume, or even on youtube, you just don't hear the phase effects.

The best thing DE ever did was develop a stereo sound system. Schmidt quickly realised that stereo panning and separation was reasonable but the best effects were heard through phasing. Almost all of his tracks have phase effects in them which is why you can only really appriciate them in person on the real hardware.

The best example of this in Hook is the jackpot reward music. If you happen to have the machine turned up loud it's like nothing you've ever heard before. Fills the room and it's like some of the sounds are even coming from behind you. For 1991 it's wild.

TAF in comparison is flat and 1-dimensional, but has the ruleset.

Anyway, my point is don't let a simple ruleset define how good a pin is. Hook is a masterpiece and if you want to step up to a pin and have a 30 minute jackpot fest, pretty much off the bat, it's brilliant.
Click to expand...
I need Hook in my life 🙌
 
Controversial opinion.....

The more influential the band, the worse the game....

Beetles, Rolling Stones, Elvis, Led Zep, epic musicians, bang average games

Metallica, Rush, Elton, Iron Maiden, GnR, Foo Fighters. pinball bangers, just turn down the volume 😁
 
David_Vi said:
My two pence, theme is irrelevant for the most part 🙂


Also does Pool Sharks count as aquatic? It's not a great game compared to others of the same era. But it's also Pool🤨
Click to expand...

Not sure Pool sharks counts, they ceased living in the sea and play pool instead, loads of plot holes in that one. Has anyone mentioned White Water, best aquatic game by a long way.....

Good point on theme, largely agree, theme seems to have less influence on how good a game is, more on value and collectability.
 
Playboy, Dolly Parton, Lady Luck, Pinball Champ, Diamond Lady, Mati Hari, Strikes and Spares, Bad Girls...... the list is endless.

They all have something in common. Could maybe add Genesis to that list :oops:
 
johnwhitfield said:
Where do we stand on surf and safari? Is it land or aquatic?
Click to expand...
Def Aquatic - it’s a water park , and Rockin Rodney is a water dweller .

I also stand by it being aquatic as at one time some years ago I had it in my aquatic themed line of games ….

Baywatch, Surf, Fishy and WH20 .

At one point I had Seawitch and Fathom here which made a nice themed pair .

258180A7-CA5B-4F06-8C16-4728A740CA4E.webp
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom