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New Stern EULA

Fubar

Fubar

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Feb 5, 2020
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Not liking the wording of this - they're banning all 3rd-party hardware, any custom code (like JP2), and forbidding streaming!

Are we even bound by these terms when buying a machine second-hand?

 
The only time I can see they will have power to do anything is if you have a warranty claim. They will just blame the failure on 3rd party hardware and refuse to help. Other than that there is nothing they can do to stop you modifying your machine
 
Julian said:
Pretty much everything, so speakers, subs, colourdmd, LEDs, mods etc...

How they will 'police' it I wonder.
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I assume they'll nuke your warranty and block you from the Stern online network that's coming. Kinda like Sony/Microsoft banning people from PSN/Xbox Live who have modded their consoles.

I get they have a serious responsibility to licence holders but it would help if they actually paid for some assets so we don't need to less with the code etc
 
Davey D said:
The only time I can see they will have power to do anything is if you have a warranty claim. They will just blame the failure on 3rd party hardware and refuse to help. Other than that there is nothing they can do to stop you modifying your machine
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Machines will be connected soon. They will prevent updates and the EULA even says they could remotely brick the machine... Not sure that's realistic though.

Realistically, I imagine they would go after the people selling the infringing stuff, not the buyers.
 
Yes it can stop your warranty but stern s warranty is nothing anyway so no problems there
I doubt it will all go online you are probably always going to have the sd card in there so you just pop another one in it with custom code like I do at the min
The only reason you would want to contact to the internet is to play in groups share scores and do updates so if you where to use a custom code then just don’t connect
Stern are being childish really as the custom code for lots of games massively increased sales the standard sound on twd was shocking I bet cleland increase sales by 20% on that game with his sound upgrade
 
I saw speculation of this happening in the pinside LZ thread. Maybe it was a bad idea with them getting that theme...
 
I guess it'll come down to how compelling the Stern online network is in years to come and how zealously Stern enforce the rules on users.
 
Good luck to them "bricking" hardware because they dont like it... Yes, you are allowed to restrict access to your platform, however AFAIK intentionally making something into a paperweight is downright illegal.. (In the UK anyhow)...
 
They are covering their ars3.
Sterns platforms are licensed, the code is not open source but peeps use Pinball browser etc...
That’s great but this was inevitable.
 
This is petty of the highest order. This is no more than post purchase control, masked as a licensing and warranty issue.
 
Slimetime said:
This is petty of the highest order. This is no more than post purchase control, masked as a licensing and warranty issue.
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Petty, draconian and certain to create bad feeling between manufacturer and customer. Terrible PR from a company who are clearly quite secure and sure of their self importance as the industries leading brand.

In other news CocaCola have banned the public from pouring their product into a glass or mixing it with any alcoholic beverage.
 
Truthfully - I once changed my code slightly using pinball browser in Aerosmith Pro. Had random 'coin insert' sounds whilst in standby, and a few funny things happening in other parts of the game.

Put the original code back in - worked fine.

It is no secret that shaker motors have blown up cabinet node boards.

Travelling around I see loads of awful mods added onto games - like extra lights piggybacked onto others (yes on modern sterns!) and to be honest - depending what mA the mods draw, the chip can control, you could blow componets on these boards. Is that Sterns fault? No - it is not.

Does anyone here want to hack their washing machine code so it gives faster spins in the 3rd cycle ? I would guess not but if you have the know how - you could do it....

Changing the LCD graphics in TMNT Stern does not change the gameplay/code at all. Once any code is 'hacked' and given out on pinside etc - Stern can just release new code and it will wipe all your changes anyway.

On the wawrranty front - if you buy a game from Pinball Heaven and a node goes, Phil will more than likely send you an advance replacement. Stern will not see your game to see if you have changed the speakers, or put in LED lights underneath the cabinet.

If Spike III has WiFi access, then they will still have to have permission off you to 'phone home' - so it is simple. When Spike III comes out - just do updates from USB. Stern will keep the USB on the PCBs as operators wont always have a machine near a wifi they can link into.

I do not think it is 'third party mods' that cause problems - it is tinkerers who read a post on a website and attempt it themselves.

Another reason I suspect why Stern have done this is to stop people using the code in virtual pinballs. So far they have blocked Spike emulation.
 
Mod makers have always lived with this risk nothing new, especially those creating things without the license and frankly in my view if you aren't licensed then you don't have any defence.

Things like speakers and lights they can't do **** about other than invalidate your warranty for that element of the machine.

Paul is right they can't brick a machine and stop it being used for the purpose it was intended for. If they did we can wheel our games to Phil's and get our money back.

They can ban you from what ever the stern network is going to be. But thats going to be on future games and not sure will be that big a deal for many. thy cant do **** retrospectively.
 
Simply - buy a pinball. Plug it into the wall. Play it.

If you mod using third party products - it is the customers choice if they want to void warranties and risk the game.

Stern could be very clever here, do what Wayne did in Australia many years ago with the Bally/Williams license. If someone makes a good product - he licensed it, allowed them to put hologram stickers on it and get a cut per item sold or a lump sum.

Maybe give trusted mod manufacturers access to the node board software and code so they could do decent products that carry the 'approved from Stern' sticker.

If you start messing with code or soldering on daft mods, and you brick your machine - it is not Pinball Heaven's problem (or any other retailer). I had four pals in the past who bricked iPhones from installing jailbreak software. Apple did not replace the phones.
 
strobey said:
Well that's the last stern i ever buy
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I wish I could take this understandable stance but I just like Stern pins too much. I still fancy an AIQ, a Deadpool and a Stranger Things. I'm glad Led Zeppelin looks crap. It was almost a relief tbh. If they knock out a decent Godzilla I'll give them my cash again I imagine.
 
It was tongue in cheek but the whole thing is bollox. The warranty is like 28 days anyway so i don't know why they bother wasting legal money on a EULA
 
^^^ When Disney etc.... see Sterns pins out in the wild running unauthorised IP, that’s a problem.
Stern have to do their diligence. I’m surprised why Disney etc.... haven’t started asking probing questions as to why Sterns code can be exploited so easily.
 
don’t forget that the cpu board has firmware in it that is closed source. You can change the sd card all you like but when that firmware is set to locked you are done...

and you don’t need an internet connection to lock a game. I wouldn’t be surprised if a checksum based on the sum of all stock sound and music data is soon embedded into the firmware at each local update therefore locking out any ‘custom sd cards’ and ending the pinball browser party once and for all

I don’t even think stern want to do this but the amount of crap pin browser stuff out there is forcing their hand
 
myPinballs said:
don’t forget that the cpu board has firmware in it that is closed source. You can change the sd card all you like but when that firmware is set to locked you are done...

and you don’t need an internet connection to lock a game. I wouldn’t be surprised if a checksum based on the sum of all stock sound and music data is soon embedded into the firmware at each local update therefore locking out any ‘custom sd cards’ and ending the pinball browser party once and for all

I don’t even think stern want to do this but the amount of crap pin browser stuff out there is forcing their hand
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Good point on the checksum, but you can always change a CPU board in worse case scenario. Send them back the old one for a slight discount. It would be a 'Ive been a naughty boy' fine. Maybe if you put in a modded SD card image it should give you at least two warnings before it bricks the game!

Oh saying that - before bricking the CPU it could also brick the node boards......
 
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