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In Progress Laser Ball - Williams

Doh ignor original post, was looking on a phone and did not have the orentatation of the game.

The flipper acting like that could be a few things...
Bent shaft in bushing, try swapping the flippers over.
Coil and pluger out of alignment.
Bent flipper baseplate.


Original post,

Players will get elimination credit for forced fall damage either through Impulse Grenades or destroying structures underneath their enemies.
  • Breaking the base of a structure will count the same as breaking the exact piece a player is standing on before they fall.
 
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Are you 100% sure the coil is wired correctly.

Don’t go by the coil lugs or the diodes, look for the wires coming of the coil winding to the lugs, you should have two pair’s different sizes that are the ends of each loop on the coil. Make sure that these are wired up correctly and the diode is correct.
 
Ive tried freely moving the flipper by hand on the with the disc element of it to press the shaft into the coil - this feels comparable to the working flipper, but it is a two minute job to switch over so will give that a go as well as the base plate.

As for the actual coil wiring, this is a completely different coil and is doing the same thing, shouldn’t assume that’s wired correctly too, but seems strange that is acting the same way.
 
If you got enough slack swap the main left and right coil returns over (grey wires i think) and see if the problem moves over with the change.
If the problem moves issue is with the wires or board.
If the problem does not move the issue is mechanical.
 
So... after a lot of work and faffing about including swapping entire coils over etc - I now have two working lower coils. I have no NO switch installed currently.


For the upper flipper the power will come in off of this wire which was powering it previously.

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I will then work out what the other two wires need to connect to for the NO switch and I should have 3 working flippers :)
 
Well as the tree said to the lumberjack, I am stumped.

So I started off today by replacing TIP102 and 2N4401 associated with Solenoid 6.

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Turned the game on, started a game and the ball return solenoid kicked in and fuse didn't blow, could hear a humm that got louder until finally fuse popped again.

Took out both coils, replaced coil with a replacement that was a retro fit option off of my No Fear where I downgraded the coil, luckily as I say it was a replacement size as per the coil meter, added new diodes to existing coil after testing resistance.

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Fired up the game again, fuse instantly popped.

Pulled 2J11 again, fuse doesn't pop.

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Checked through pins on driver board by jumping from plug to board to see if anything is firing, pin 2 is the culprit, which again is the purple wire, whoops maybe I replaced the wrong TIP102 and 2N4401, pull board out, replace them on solenoid 7, as I should have to begin with.

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Jumper wire, and guess it is still firing. Is there any chance that the board is getting a signal from the drop target mechanism telling it to fire when it shouldn't? Checked the targets are in "up" position, they are.
 
So had another mess around.

Found that there was two leads connecting onto the solenoid 7, which was at the end of the row, this was coming from LA which is solenoid 3, then should have been going to SER solenoid 4, I had it going to 7, LL, I am assuming that this will probably be what blew the TIP102, and has done again, hence why it is shorting? To confirm, at the end of the line (i.e. solenoid 7) that there should only be power supply in, not another wire coming off.

Couldn't be asked to re-solder ANOTHER TIP102, so have taken off the return to the troublesome coil (solenoid 7), decided to do a solenoid test on the game, all solenoids but 7 are firing, which if the return is off of 7 I assume that is why. In a game.

Checked switches, some of them are... sticky, so will register eventually, but takes a few presses, is there a way to clean these?
 
So close. If you are referring to the leaf-switches I just hold them closed and drag a bit of paper through them to polish up the contacts and remove any dirt.
 
Adajam4 said:
So had another mess around.

Found that there was two leads connecting onto the solenoid 7, which was at the end of the row, this was coming from LA which is solenoid 3, then should have been going to SER solenoid 4, I had it going to 7, LL, I am assuming that this will probably be what blew the TIP102, and has done again, hence why it is shorting? To confirm, at the end of the line (i.e. solenoid 7) that there should only be power supply in, not another wire coming off.

Couldn't be asked to re-solder ANOTHER TIP102, so have taken off the return to the troublesome coil (solenoid 7), decided to do a solenoid test on the game, all solenoids but 7 are firing, which if the return is off of 7 I assume that is why. In a game.

Checked switches, some of them are... sticky, so will register eventually, but takes a few presses, is there a way to clean these?
Click to expand...
Sounds like you found the issue, but don't envy you soldering in transistors, but......it has to be done, so chin up. My worst two jobs so far in pin mtce:
1. Replacing Mosfet transistors on a circuit board.
2. Replacing old Lamp sockets
 
I’m not sure that it is the problem, I’ve changed the transistor once but not sure if having two positives to the solenoid will have popped it again. Would be +56V and im sure the TP102 is rated higher than that.

As for drop targets, solenoids working but no point scoring, would this suggest they need a clean, seems strange.
 
Nope made no difference, swapped two socketed chips I had on the board, other chip doing same thing.

Possibly PIA issue, will look at how to probe logic off of it.
 
Checked Pin 8 of the PIA, getting a +4.8V on the PIA, which will be locking coil, originating from there. bloomin' replacement PIA.... They are not cheap.
 
Going to be on the cosmetic and switch issue side as ordered some PIA chips from
China on the long haul, Novus arrived today and gave it a go over with 2... comparatively, she is gleeming compared to where it was. Looking gorgeous (again, comparatively). She still has a hairy chest mind.

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The drop targets need to come out and be cleaned, solenoids working but not registering drops or resetting. All plastics need cleaning. Rubbers need attaching. . Switches need sorting as some contact every other rollover. Rollover switches need to come out and be cleaned.

Lots to do but feeling better again (honestly my emotions with this, I’m like a teenager) and raring to go
 
Oh how I have fun... so this week I managed to spend a little time looking over what the issue was with the resetting of the banks of targets and I remember back when I first had the machine working and fully functional, that the left spinner wasn't working, well of course, knowing what I know now I thought I would check the wiring diagram, sure enough on the diagram the all the drop targets and that spinner are on the same column, so I booted the game up, took off the column and switch rows and tried to jumper that column, nothing, nudda, nowt. Ordered myself another SN7406 (or two) will socket that along with the known bad PIA, then if still no joy just socket and swapout the other PIA, that driver board will be have more newer parts in it than when it was first built soon.

So tonight I was going to dive in and just sort that flipper out with the NO switch that arrived, and using the simple instructions given my @Jay Walker (thanks once again sir). So install the switch.... something crazy started happening with the flipper, it was pulling in then "bouncing around" like some crazy drunk on a night out... then.... nothing. Game off, check flipper fuse, all good, great, something else to change on the driver board, after a lot of head scratching and cursing, I quickly thought I should check the 8ASB I installed as per vid's guide...

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Sure enough that pesky blighter had blown, popped a new one in and away we went again. Coil out, checked coil, getting no reading across lugs (diode cut), swapped for know good coil, rechecked wiring, bottom coil pulling in, top coil making that strange pulling in attempt but not actually "flipping".

More head scratching, more confusion, more rechecking wiring, then I thought... the only thing I hadn't yet changed was the top flipper EOS switch, surely that couldn't be it, EOS switches don't go do they. Well, I believe that actually.. yes they do, swapped it over and boom....


For the eagle eyed of you out there, theloghts below the flipper are lighting up with every few strikes, need to understand whether this is a flipper knocking a switch or a wiring issue... which I thought I had solved. Each step forward hey...

Well, this had taken far longer than I planned, so my night of cleaning plastics and rebuilding the playfield was reduced to this.... and even that isn't done, the Novus took so much cr@p off of the plastic, I would say it was unreal but you can see the old rubbers there...

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The lamps show that the bonus is building up in value, which obviously shouldn't happen simply from using the flippers. Some possible causes could be;
  • Spiking from faulty/missing tie-back diodes, though I'd expect it to be worse than that, and unpredictable
  • A switch matrix fault linked to a "Lane Change" contact (or contacts) on the flipper unit(s) - not the case here
  • Some contact on the playfield closing or contacting somehow under vibration, with the resulting activity (sound, scoring, lamps)
Going with the 3rd possibility, have a look what score goes up for each change, or put the game in switch test, and with the drop targets up and the ball absent from the playfield hammer away at the flippers. Since there's no lane change on this game, there should be no indication of any switch closing under these conditions

Williams (far from) Wonderful Drop Targets were a menace back then, and were the cause of a late in the day change to the legendary game Fire Power (they were deleted due to poor reliability). Each target has a copper horse-shoe attached, with two contact points. These brush over a circuit board, which has two sections. The contacts register across the upper section as the target falls, then pass over to the lower section, where they remain in contact. The entire target bank, which may not be in one group, has to register an extra 'Series' contact through all the circuit boards before the bank counts as completed
 
I wanted to start rebuilding the play field today, I think when I flipped it I found that the bonus multiplier switch was bent and closed so imagine that happened during the vigorous clean and was probably the cause of the problem, I am not going to put the GI lighting back in as am going to probably LED this, but want to wait to ensure that I actually have a working and playable game before I go with that. One thing I have learned so far is everything takes longer than expected. I was looking at the play field and decided to take off the lower metal bracket as it looked awful, you probably won't even see it, but I knew it was there. Managed to get it up to this.

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After that, all I got out of two hours work was a cleaner bar... some cleaned metal work and the ball return parts back onto the PF.

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*Nice shiny ball was to test.
 

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So, still waiting on the SIP sockets and the other bits from China, so I now looking at the cosmetic side some more. Haven't been as "on it" lately due to not having these parts and stretching out the time I can spend on it.

Gave the backglass a clean tonight, what do you know.. it is mirrored under there. There is some peeling on the back, well, it is more like cracking, doesn't appear to be happening any more, is there anything to do here, or just leave it? It seems to have stopped.

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I think this just shows how much work goes into cleaning something like this, can you guess which one has been done?

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Spent quite a bit of time just cleaning up plastics like this, putting the rubbers into place, ready to repopulate, testing bulbs, cleaning them (I am going incandescent on the upper playfield, LED in backbox and under inserts).

Have waxed the playfield and started to repopulate now. I think it is strange how well the plastics have done, they actually show the playfield up when cleaned.

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It is random the things we do, I have also been cleaning out the cabinet tonight off and on when I have a bit of cloth that just moist still (JUST) and dirty, still lifting so much dirt off... will have to do that properly as well now.
 
I was a late arrival to The Walking Dead. I watched the whole back catalogue with a tin of metal polish and a box of pinball parts.

I have two more machines to do so waiting for the next season of Vikings to drop. Given up on TWD
 
So this morning the PIA chips and SIP sockets arrived so I could crack on a little more.

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I started by removing the 40 PIN PIA - that was a job and a half, I went the route of cutting the legs off and then using the solder sucker to pull the solder out. I socketed using one of the chips to hold it in place. After that I also replaced teh SN7406 for the row out I have on the switches.

Well, 50% success, no more locking on when the game comes on, plus there was sound! WAHOO! I guess that means I have to change the other PIA over, that is a job for tomorrow though.

Given that I pressed on by putting all of the rubbers on, and starting to put the machine back together.

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I then moved on to cleaning the plastics, deary me, they were extremely dirty, but they did start to come up really well.

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So here we are... doesn't she look better, from the then....

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To the now.

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Here is a small video of her working (apart from that one row)


The one thing though... the drop targets are standing up now once complete, but some aren't scoring... is this the PIA or do the targets need cleaning?
 
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Looking good - I don't envy you soldering those PIA chips and sockets. You should be able to test the target switches easily enough with your meter & the power off?
 
Hi @AlanJ - randomly everything has started scoring and resetting, even the left spinner, there is three switches that probably just need adjusting that aren't working.

I did have a strange incident earlier though, all solenoids, all flippers just died. Nothing.

Turned off and on again and it was absolutely fine....

Hmmm...
 
Great job, well done for sticking with it, it's looking soooo nice.

Regarding the power off, cast your eye over all the boards in the backbox and make sure there are not any stand up components like resistors or transistors bent over and touching their neighbour. Heat transfer from one component to another can cause crazy things to happen.
 
I will give that a check tomorrow, I have made this little video for you all :) - hope you like it, highlights the remaining issues, I can see 3 switches that have issues, plus 3 drop targets not scoring...

 
A few tweaks on the switches and I have two more working and just 2 on the play field that aren't, (I think rollover 8 and rollover 4).

On the drop target front, I am down to just 2 not working here too, L and A, which if i press in further by hand for the drop, they score, so it is just an adjustment...

I have posted in the technical help, I am now getting just chimes instead of the normal sounds I was getting, weird...

So I have a cabinet that needs some painting work, I am no artist, but I am giving it a go, it will need doing again to neaten up, but started with the red...

From this..

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To this...

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It is still drying, but it is a bit patchy and I will give it another once over, but it is certainly better :)
 
There is a toggle on the sound board I believe - check all the connections also


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
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