Stern vs B/W vs Gottlieb vs Data East for maintenance?

[MarkS]

I've been looking at a couple of Gottliebs and DataEast machines for sale recently that I like the look of, but I'm unsure how they compare to Sterns and Bally Williams in terms of maintenance, repair, diagnostics, etc? I currently have 3 x Sterns, and previously I've had a few B/W and once upon a time even a Data East Simpsons... but as I'm not very au fait with electronics or repairing machines, I'm wondering how much of a headache they might be in terms of ownership, everything from availability and cost of consumables (rubbers, bulbs, etc), to replacement parts (ramps, boards) to diagnostics?

I'm happy/keen to learn more about fixing/repairing and I know people on here are extremely generous in helping out, but how do people view the different makes in terms of ownership? On the one hand the current WH2O thread reminds me that even B/W plastics/playfields can cost a fortune, but then are DataEast a lot less reliable and will a System 3 be a nightmare to diagnose and fix? And will I be able to get parts I need at a reasonable cost? Worst case will I always be able to send it off to the pros to be fixed?

 

[M4carp]

I have found them pretty much the same when things go wrong, after fixing issues with a Robocop it was pretty reliable and had no problems after, same with a system 3 which are normally very reliable. My Gottlieb 80b’s never give me problems but that’s with myPinballs mpu boards fitted and modded ground.

Most parts available but mostly overseas, sometimes you will have to get inventive to fix things.

Always someone on here who can repair boards for you if you can’t.

Go for it, what’s the worst that can happen?

 

[Wayne J]

The likelihood is that any machine over 20 years old has had to have repairs made to it for it to still be in a fully working state - the issue is how well that repair has been done and if it has been done by a competent person.

Modern Sterns are at least as reliable as any other manufacturers' machine when they first came out - but any issues that do arise will be the first time they have arisen. Occasionally there is a design fault from NIB that needs tweaking (think the under playfield ball transfer on AIQ) but once these are fixed they are bullet proof. You don't get that in the older machines because the issue has already been fixed.

The complexity of mechs in older games compared to most modern Sterns means that they are more prone to needing tweaking.

Availability of spare parts is also likely a real issue for older games.

 

[Pick Holder]

I wouldnt advise anyone buying a data east or gottlieb. Parts for gottliebs are harder to get and data east games are in my opinion 10 years behind bally williams !

Get a bally williams dmd game or a modern stern.

You cant go wrong. But all pins will go wrong.

If you dont have repair skills yourself. Buy on here from a trusted member. In the past I have offered collection and check over services for people I know who buy of ebay.

 

[MarkS]

Thanks for the replies but I fear I'm still none the wiser

I see machines like TFTC (DE) or Class of 1812 / Surf'n'Safari which are decent machines, are they really going to be a major problem further down the line if I see them fully working just because they are DE or Gottlieb? I'm not interested in restorations and sourcing new ramps etc... when people talk about problems sourcing parts, what sort of parts would be problematic? Sorry if that's a dumb question.

The reason I'm looking is partly to scratch a few itches of some games I've fancied, and partly to have an alternative from some of the loooooooong playing times... fancy some more wham-bam-oh-its-all-over type games that don't take half an hour

 

[Sgt GrizZ]

Thanks for the replies but I fear I'm still none the wiser

I see machines like TFTC (DE) or Class of 1812 / Surf'n'Safari which are decent machines, are they really going to be a major problem further down the line if I see them fully working just because they are DE or Gottlieb? I'm not interested in restorations and sourcing new ramps etc... when people talk about problems sourcing parts, what sort of parts would be problematic? Sorry if that's a dumb question.

The reason I'm looking is partly to scratch a few itches of some games I've fancied, and partly to have an alternative from some of the loooooooong playing times... fancy some more wham-bam-oh-its-all-over type games that don't take half an hour

I would say the knowledge base for Gottlieb particularly seems much smaller in this country. I have had a couple over the years and was def out of my comfort zone tinkering with them. There are of course people who know them inside out but if you do run into electronic issues it may not be quite as easy to get advice or sort out a repair as it is with Bally Williams. Not saying you won't be able to, but it may need a bit more effort.

TBH though if the game is working ok I wouldn't get too hung up worrying about future issues - impossible to predict.

 

[Moonraker]

Gottlieb's are pretty bullet proof. Pre system 3 games need bullet proofing with earthng mods and possibly new connectors (depends on the condition of those fitted). These may already have been done if they're working now.
DE are the fore runner to stem. Many circuits are almost identical across different makes as there are only so many ways you can drive a DMD or solid state display. Likewise transistors driving the solenoids, etc.
Plenty of parts available. @pinballmania can normally source Gottlieb items.