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Flash Gordon Flipper (and Saucer kick-out)

VeeMonroe

VeeMonroe

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And... I'm straight in with technical questions.

Flash Gordon was okay when I viewed/played it and it arrived fine. But, second play, the right flipper now won't sit correctly (see photo) and it has a limited range of movement, as a result.

I can push it back into the correct position manually, but it's a little stiff. Obviously, the minute anyone presses the flipper button, it drops back into the slightly lifted position again.

Suggestions on how to fix, please.

tempImageDuk5VD.jpg

It also has an annoying fault, which I knew about when I bought it, whereby the saucer literally flings the ball down the right outlane like Flash Gordon on a rocket cycle - sometimes vigorously enough to hit the glass.

Again, all suggestions for fixing that one welcome, but flippers probably a priority.
 
Take the flipper mech apart and clean the coil sleeve (or even better put a new one in).

Check the plunger end: if it's mushroomed you will want to change that as well as the stop.

Also make sure the return spring is on correctly and not broken.
 
Sounds like the saucer may have the wrong coil fitted. The flipper is usually a worn end stop and as others have said a rebuild is no bad thing.
 
Sven Normansson said:
Sounds like the saucer may have the wrong coil fitted. The flipper is usually a worn end stop and as others have said a rebuild is no bad thing.
Click to expand...
My guess was wrong coil, as well. It fires the pinball like a bullet!

I'll check the end stops.
 
Worn sleeves or the coil being in loose or too tight can cause friction on the plunger causing it not to return smoothly.

I'd lift the pf and fiddle with the plunger, you'll soon feel where the friction is coming from and be able to check the return spring is doing its job too
 
it could be a worn pawl on the linear flipper assembly,they are supposed to be round,but if original are now probably flat on one side with age
 
Can the ejector arm of the saucer be 'adjusted' to alter the direction imparted to the ball? If the 2-way unit allows it. There is a vector diagram in the manual, showing that Down should pass just above and to the left (approx. 11 o'clock) of the l/h bumper. Up should hit (hopefully not too hard) the ball guide to the right of the single drop target.

The coil chart shows that the winding used for Kick Down is much weaker than for Kick Up, as you'd expect. Its critical spec. is listed as '29-1200', 1200 turns of 29 gauge.

Sorry, that's 29-2100 for the Kick Down solenoid.
 
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Check the gap between the flipper and bushing, easy to do - pull the flipper up and push down from the pivot (fat) end with your fingers and see if there is play, if not you need to gap the flippers properly (loosen and drop the pawl slightly down the shaft)

What happens when the saucer fires towards the upper playfield?
 
Save yourself a lot of grief and time. Replace flippers and rebuild both sides.(end stop, eos, sleeve, pawl/lever,nyliner, springs , nylon bearing,plunger) also important to check gap like @mufcmufc Nick suggested above. Check for correct coil in saucer. Should be a AO-27-1300 up, AO-29-2100 down. image.jpgimage.jpgthen change the saucer vector by gently straightening the eject arm. Sorted😎
image.jpg
 
new forest pinball said:
Save yourself a lot of grief and time. Replace flippers and rebuild both sides.(end stop, eos, sleeve, pawl/lever,nyliner, springs , nylon bearing,plunger) also important to check gap like @mufcmufc Nick suggested above. Check for correct coil in saucer. Should be a AO-27-1300 up, AO-29-2100 down. View attachment 167687View attachment 167688then change the saucer vector by gently straightening the eject arm. Sorted😎
View attachment 167689
Click to expand...
Thanks for the diagram! :) I've had the opportunity to have a brief look at the flipper assembly and, ludicrously, the original flipper assembly on the left is fine. The right-hand one that isn't working properly is brand sparkling new and was evidently installed during the restoration! :eek: It looks like a spring problem, to be honest. When I pull the plunger on the flipper back manually, it just sits there!!

I'll do a bit more investigation and see whether I can narrow the problem down any more. Otherwise, it looks like I can get springs from Marcos.

mufcmufc said:
What happens when the saucer fires towards the upper playfield?
Click to expand...
It doesn't... At least, from what I can see.

It exclusively shoots the ball down the right outline like a cannon ball.
 
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VeeMonroe said:
Thanks for the diagram! :) I've had the opportunity to have a brief look at the flipper assembly and, ludicrously, the original flipper assembly on the left is fine. The right-hand one that isn't working properly is brand sparkling new and was evidently installed during the restoration! :eek: It looks like a spring problem, to be honest. When I pull the plunger on the flipper back manually, it just sits there!!
Click to expand...
Unscrew the end stop and loosen it all off (inspect the end stop for any damage or wear, even if new). Then make sure the plunger moves freely in the coil and that the spring pulls it back, then tighten up the end stop slowly and keep checking it runs free. I bought a machine a couple of years ago with all its flippers rebuilt, and several needed unscrewing and redoing - it was that simple a fix. Ive also had another machine, again with new flipper parts, but all the end stops, although new - were poor quality and caused sticking, I replaced them with a different new type and all has been good since.
 
If the saucer is only kicking down the playfield then there's something wrong their. Take a picture of the saucer kicker mech underneath and let's have a look.

What it should do is kick alternately down then up each time you drop into it as indicated by the direction the lamps strobe. The mech has two kicker arms, one for each direction.
 
ronsplooter said:
What it should do is kick alternately down then up each time you drop into it as indicated by the direction the lamps strobe. The mech has two kicker arms, one for each direction.
Click to expand...

As I saw Claude Fernandez mention in a documentary which included footage at the Bally factory. "This saucer kicks the ball up on the second time, so you have to concentrate on the target bank" The game was still a whitewood at the time.

Hold on, the ball flies out of the right outlane?. I see it as like a John Trudeau game, with the ball hitting that elbow below the target bank, changing course and having enough momentum to cross to the right out/return lane area, where it takes the outlane.
 
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Just a thought but could the assembly be in backwards with the weak kicking up and the string kicking down? I have a spare assembly somewhere that may still have the coils on it.
 
Thank goodness this machine wasn't sold by HLD otherwise this thread would be 40 pages of what a disgrace they are, I imagine no refunds or recourse on this one though, yet you seem not to mind it too much?
 
mufcmufc said:
Thank goodness this machine wasn't sold by HLD otherwise this thread would be 40 pages of what a disgrace they are, I imagine no refunds or recourse on this one though, yet you seem not to mind it too much?
Click to expand...
I bought it knowing that it had the saucer fault and being comfortable that I could sort that out.

The game was exhaustively tested before purchase and I was aware that there was no warranty, it was old and it could go wrong in transit. All this was clearly discussed during my two-hour visit and inspection of the pin. The flipper was fine before it set off - because I played the pin.

Unlike HLD, I was not told that it had been exhaustively checked through a 26-point checklist and it was also priced competitively for the quality of the restoration job.

In short, I wasn’t being hoodwinked or ripped off.
 
Is going out the left out lane. not the right as originally reported- which i must admit had me really confused as to how it was getting to the right outlane 😂
 
The kick out is far too strong. Please post picture of the underside of the saucer arrangement so we can all stop guessing what’s under there !!
 
new forest pinball said:
Save yourself a lot of grief and time. Replace flippers and rebuild both sides.(end stop, eos, sleeve, pawl/lever,nyliner, springs , nylon bearing,plunger) also important to check gap like @mufcmufc Nick suggested above. Check for correct coil in saucer. Should be a AO-27-1300 up, AO-29-2100 down. View attachment 167687View attachment 167688then change the saucer vector by gently straightening the eject arm. Sorted😎
View attachment 167689
Click to expand...
Yep, wrong coil...

It's a AN-26-1200 on the downward thrust. It's possible I've somehow never seen it shoot upwards because, obviously, the game ends pretty fast if you go anywhere near the saucer!
 

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Working flipper on left (yellow). Non-working flipper on right (green). The spring looks wrong on the non-working flipper (?). Not sure if it can be caused by anything except a spring (?).

tempImageWkkF3t.jpg

Working flipper (close up).

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Video of us fiddling with half-working flipper.

View attachment IMG_3605 2.MOV



We *think* this is a spring problem (?).
 

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it isn’t a weak spring. it’s misaligned. as i said above unscrew the end stop and it will all loosen up probably. it may be a bent plunger shaft. sometimes brand new ones are bent. take it out and roll it on a flat surface to check it.
 
AlanJ said:
it isn’t a weak spring. it’s misaligned. as i said above unscrew the end stop and it will all loosen up probably. it may be a bent plunger shaft. sometimes brand new ones are bent. take it out and roll it on a flat surface to check it.
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Got it! That's perfect. We'll try that, thanks.

If that doesn't work, we'll also try swapping the springs around, which is a genius idea I should have had... 😁

We're planning to do a full attack on it tomorrow, with all the advice here - just can't get to it today as it's in the front room and we have the two little boys with us.
 
VeeMonroe said:
Got it! That's perfect. We'll try that, thanks.

If that doesn't work, we'll also try swapping the springs around, which is a genius idea I should have had... 😁

We're planning to do a full attack on it tomorrow, with all the advice here - just can't get to it today as it's in the front room and we have the two little boys with us.
Click to expand...
We had a go this weekend fixing the flipper.

We adjusted the end stop. We also discovered the grub screws that connect the pawl to the cylinder kept working loose. We fixed the flipper and it became unfixed half a game later.

So, using YouTube videos, we’ve now ordered some blue Loctite for holding the grub screws in place. Also, we looked at the flipper bat and found out that the part of the cylinder that the grub screws press against is pretty mangled.

As the other flipper is also a little wobbly, we’ve now ordered two new flipper bats, as well.
 
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